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Hi all. Apparently my email below did not make it to the Council list. I’m trying again.
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<div>Best,</div>
<div>Paul<br>
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<div dir="ltr">Sent from my iPhone</div>
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<div dir="ltr">Begin forwarded message:<br>
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<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr"><b>From:</b> "McGrady, Jr., Paul D." <PMcGrady@taftlaw.com><br>
<b>Date:</b> April 22, 2022 at 3:09:20 PM CDT<br>
<b>To:</b> philippe.fouquart@orange.com, Jeff Neuman <jeff@jjnsolutions.com>, Justine Chew <justine.chew.icann@gmail.com>, Kurt Pritz <kurt@kjpritz.com><br>
<b>Cc:</b> GNSO Secs <gnso-secs@icann.org><br>
<b>Subject:</b> <b>RE: [council] Draft letter to the Board on closed generics dialogue</b><br>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D">Thanks Philippe, Kurt, Justine, and Jeff.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D">Dear All:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D">I’m happy with the NCSG’s letter being attached, or not, but I do think it is important to at least call it out since we don’t want to give the misimpression that the Council is completely unified on this topic.
I for one have a <b><u>great deal of sympathy</u></b> with the idea that GAC advice should not restart policy work in the GNSO, but rather the Board needs to figure out how to implement (via IRT) both the completed policy Recommendations and the GAC advice
in the next version of the Applicant Guidebook (like they did with much of the GAC advice that rolled in after the policy work was done for the first round). Hopefully something will come out of this dialogue that helps in that process.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D">As for the letter itself, I think we could just as easily say “Dear Board, of course we are happy to talk with the GAC about their concerns. We will reach out to them and get it set up.” But, we do like our
letters here in ICANNland, so my marked up version (based off the last version sent by Philippe) is attached. If we are going to frame the issues, instead of just a quick “we are on it” response, I think a tiny bit of more detail of how we got here makes
sense. Hopefully my proposed changes (which are in red on my screen) will be viewed as friendly amendments, which is the spirit in which they are offered.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D">Thank all!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D">Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D">Paul<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> council <council-bounces@gnso.icann.org> <b>On Behalf Of
</b>philippe.fouquart--- via council<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, April 22, 2022 1:57 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Jeff Neuman <jeff@jjnsolutions.com>; Justine Chew <justine.chew.icann@gmail.com>; Kurt Pritz <kurt@kjpritz.com><br>
<b>Cc:</b> GNSO Secs <gnso-secs@icann.org>; council@gnso icann. org <council@gnso.icann.org><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [council] Draft letter to the Board on closed generics dialogue<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="FR" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">[EXTERNAL MESSAGE]
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Kurt, Justine, Jeff, thanks for the inputs. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 1) and reference to the NCSG’s letter: The reference is on record with the minutes, and can also be found in the Council list archive, I don’t think there’s any risk this goes unnoticed, I’d suggest we simply say While the Council is
willing to pursue these next steps, it is important to note that Non-Commercial Stakeholders Group expressed its opposition to the approach.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Manju (since it is you who spoke on this during our call): would you be fine with this?
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 2) and modalities, I’d suggest we go for Jeff’s edits and simply say in the second paragraph:
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">The Council is appreciative of the ICANN Board’s attention to GNSO related matters and is willing to pursue next steps for the facilitated dialogue, subject to mutual agreement with the GAC on the conditions for that dialogue.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Ironically, in French, the equivalent of ‘modalities’ has a sense of a series of menial tasks that the authors would consider a) quite straightforward and b) as a result, generally not worth doing by themselves. Neither of which would probably
be true here I think. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">It seems 2) alleviates the need to elaborate as, Justine, you suggested with your 3<sup>rd</sup> point but let us know if it doesn’t work.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">As attached with diff marks.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Regards,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Philippe <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Jeff Neuman <<a href="mailto:jeff@jjnsolutions.com">jeff@jjnsolutions.com</a>>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, April 22, 2022 3:48 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Justine Chew <<a href="mailto:justine.chew.icann@gmail.com">justine.chew.icann@gmail.com</a>>; Kurt Pritz <<a href="mailto:kurt@kjpritz.com">kurt@kjpritz.com</a>>; FOUQUART Philippe INNOV/NET <<a href="mailto:philippe.fouquart@orange.com">philippe.fouquart@orange.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> GNSO Secs <<a href="mailto:gnso-secs@icann.org">gnso-secs@icann.org</a>>; council@gnso icann. org <<a href="mailto:council@gnso.icann.org">council@gnso.icann.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [council] Draft letter to the Board on closed generics dialogue<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">I strongly urge that the letter from the NCSG is not included with this letter. As Justine states, there are some mischaracterizations in that letter and as far as I am aware the rest of the Council does not agree with the opinions expressed
by the NCSG. You can indicate that the NCSG opposed the meeting in the letter without any attachments. If you include the NCSG letter, would you consider adding letters from the other SGs and Cs that are in support of the meeting? I believe the best way
is to note the NCSG’s disagreement, but not attach anything.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">And with respect to the word “modalities”, it is an unnecessary word. A “modality” is a condition is it not? So I would just state: “….that the Council is willing to pursue next steps for the facilitated dialogue, subject to mutual agreement
with the GAC on the conditions for that dialogue.”<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#06175F">Jeffrey J. Neuman</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">Founder & CEO</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#06175F">JJN Solutions, LLC</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">p: +1.202.549.5079</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">E:
</span><a href="mailto:jeff@jjnsolutions.com"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#1155CC">jeff@jjnsolutions.com</span></a><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"><a href="http://jjnsolutions.com"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#0563C1">http://jjnsolutions.com</span></a><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> council <<a href="mailto:council-bounces@gnso.icann.org">council-bounces@gnso.icann.org</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Justine Chew via council<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 21, 2022 8:12 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Kurt Pritz <<a href="mailto:kurt@kjpritz.com">kurt@kjpritz.com</a>>; Philippe Fouquart <<a href="mailto:philippe.fouquart@orange.com">philippe.fouquart@orange.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> GNSO Secs <<a href="mailto:gnso-secs@icann.org">gnso-secs@icann.org</a>>; council@gnso icann. org <<a href="mailto:council@gnso.icann.org">council@gnso.icann.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [council] Draft letter to the Board on closed generics dialogue<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Hello Philippe, Kurt,<br>
<br>
1. I agree with Kurt on the NCSG letter, and if it were to be included, I think we should at least address the assertion that "GAC has been silent since 2013 on the matter of Closed Generics" as called out by Jeff as a mis-characterization of the GAC on the
part of NCSG.<br clear="all">
<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
2. I understand the word "modalities" to mean "ways of doing something", but if there's a better word to address Kurt's concerns then by all means, let's consider that.<br>
<br>
3. Would it be feasible to add to the end of the second paragraph, a suggestion that "the conditions and modalities for that dialogue" will be forthcoming? That would indicate that Council is giving thought to those and will continue to do so (hence allowing
for the Closed Generics small team leeway to do its work).<br>
<br>
Thanks for considering.<br>
<br>
<span style="color:black">Kind regards,</span><br>
<span style="color:black">Justine</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Fri, 22 Apr 2022 at 06:54, Kurt Pritz via council <<a href="mailto:council@gnso.icann.org" target="_blank">council@gnso.icann.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Hi Philippe:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Two comments: <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">1. If the NCSG has requested that reference to their comment should be included it in the letter, then we should include it. If not, you might ask if they want that (and if they do, include it). I don’t think it adds value at this point
— but will add value as we get into the meeting set-up, the discussion scope, and the actions taken with any recommendations that come out of the meeting. <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">2. I personally recommend that we avoid the use of the term ‘modalities.’ I don’t know what it means and, if participating in a group tasked with identifying them, I wouldn’t know what they are. I right clicked on the word and found that
Microsoft knows of no synonyms. I looked it up in a popular online dictionary and came up with: <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">— the quality or state of being modal; a modal quality or attribute; <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">— the classification of logical propositions according to their asserting or denying the possibility, impossibility, contingency, or necessity of their content; <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">— one of the main avenues of sensation (such as vision); <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">— a usually physical therapeutic agency<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Not getting the sense from there, I looked for its use in a sentence and found: <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">"Ineluctable modality of the visible: at least that if no more, thought through my eyes.”
<i>The New Yorker, 7 Feb. 2022</i><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">That did not help me understand the definition but did tell me a lot about the kind of people that use the word. I understand the word is commonly used in governmental settings but we needn’t adopt the custom if it is not clarifying or
helpful.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Slightly more seriously, when we meet among ourselves and with the GAC, we should all understand the target and “modalities” seems too broad. It would be helpful for me (maybe it is just me) to replace the word with commonly spoken terms
or to parenthetically define it. <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks for listening, <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Kurt<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Apr 22, 2022, at 3:32 AM, philippe.fouquart--- via council <<a href="mailto:council@gnso.icann.org" target="_blank">council@gnso.icann.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Dear Councilors,<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Please find attached for you review a draft response letter to the ICANN Board on closed generics. It intends to capture the conclusions of our discussion during the Council call last week.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">We would like to have it ready for the Board workshop next week, so please have a look before April 27th 1200 UTC (Wednesday)<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Regards,<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div id="m_-4038912784381267194m_2143369861284934293m_-3787636286628429680gmail-m_4842439485837884111composer_signature">
<p class="MsoNormal">Philippe <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<pre>_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p> </o:p></pre>
<pre>Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confidentielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages electroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou falsifie. Merci.<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p> </o:p></pre>
<pre>This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged information that may be protected by law;<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and delete this message and its attachments.<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have been modified, changed or falsified.<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Thank you.<o:p></o:p></pre>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><Closed Generics_Council to ICANN Board - 20 April 2022.docx>_______________________________________________<br>
council mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:council@gnso.icann.org" target="_blank">council@gnso.icann.org</a><br>
<a href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/council" target="_blank">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/council</a><br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
By submitting your personal data, you consent to the processing of your personal data for purposes of subscribing to this mailing list accordance with the ICANN Privacy Policy (<a href="https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy" target="_blank">https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy</a>)
and the website Terms of Service (<a href="https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos" target="_blank">https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos</a>). You can visit the Mailman link above to change your membership status or configuration, including unsubscribing, setting digest-style
delivery or disabling delivery altogether (e.g., for a vacation), and so on.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal">_______________________________________________<br>
council mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:council@gnso.icann.org" target="_blank">council@gnso.icann.org</a><br>
<a href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/council" target="_blank">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/council</a><br>
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_______________________________________________<br>
By submitting your personal data, you consent to the processing of your personal data for purposes of subscribing to this mailing list accordance with the ICANN Privacy Policy (<a href="https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy" target="_blank">https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy</a>)
and the website Terms of Service (<a href="https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos" target="_blank">https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos</a>). You can visit the Mailman link above to change your membership status or configuration, including unsubscribing, setting digest-style
delivery or disabling delivery altogether (e.g., for a vacation), and so on.<o:p></o:p></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<pre><span lang="FR">_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="FR"><o:p> </o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="FR">Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confidentielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="FR">pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="FR">a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages electroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="FR">Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou falsifie. Merci.<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="FR"><o:p> </o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="FR">This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged information that may be protected by law;<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="FR">they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="FR">If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and delete this message and its attachments.<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="FR">As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have been modified, changed or falsified.<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="FR">Thank you.<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
</div>
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