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<div style="font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class="elementToProof">
Thank you Alberto Soto Roland for the query "Who is End - User"?</div>
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To my mind, unless Localization and Local Language are factored, a specification of "End - User" would be elusive.</div>
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If I can use Technology without Blaming Technology then I may be ranked better than End - User.</div>
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We all owe a professional responsibility for this rapidly increasing segment of End - Users".</div>
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I have been looking upto ICANN for the umbrella term "Geopolitics" from the technology basis.</div>
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Your thoughts are most welcome.</div>
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Sincerely,</div>
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Gopal T V</div>
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T V Gopal</span><br style="font-family: "Segoe UI", "Segoe UI Web (West European)", "Segoe UI", -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, Roboto, "Helvetica Neue", sans-serif; font-size: 14.6667px; text-align: start; color: rgb(32, 31, 30); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">
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of Computer Science and Engineering</span><br style="font-family: "Segoe UI", "Segoe UI Web (West European)", "Segoe UI", -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, Roboto, "Helvetica Neue", sans-serif; font-size: 14.6667px; text-align: start; color: rgb(32, 31, 30); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">
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of Engineering</span><br style="font-family: "Segoe UI", "Segoe UI Web (West European)", "Segoe UI", -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, Roboto, "Helvetica Neue", sans-serif; font-size: 14.6667px; text-align: start; color: rgb(32, 31, 30); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">
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<div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" style="font-size:11pt" color="#000000"><b>From:</b> Alberto Soto Roldan <alberto@soto.net.ar><br>
<b>Sent:</b> 21 April 2023 10:24<br>
<b>To:</b> gopal <gopal@annauniv.edu>; 'CPWG' <cpwg@icann.org><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users</font>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="">I agree with everything said. But I ask: who is the end user? I once argued with the CEO of ICANN (Fadi) when he said: "We are all end users." And I replied: it is partially true, but I believe that within
ICANN we are all end users with knowledge of all Internet regulations, of our rights and obligations. But we should consider as an end user who is unaware of all this, and therefore, does not have the capacity to fight and demand for their rights. And we end
users in the ALS-RALO-ALAC path are responsible for taking concerns and problems to the ICANN board of directors and proposing the necessary solutions for the "end user". Otherwise, only the opinion of the representatives of the ALA-RALO-ALAC will reach the
Junta Dieciva, and not of the "end users".</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="">Best</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="">Alberto</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><b><span lang="ES">De:</span></b><span lang="ES"> CPWG <cpwg-bounces@icann.org>
<b>En nombre de </b>gopal via CPWG<br>
<b>Enviado el:</b> jueves, 20 de abril de 2023 19:08<br>
<b>Para:</b> CPWG <cpwg@icann.org><br>
<b>Asunto:</b> Re: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; color:#002451">Dear All,</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt; color:black"></span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; color:#002451">In my humble opinion, we need to look at the lighter side as well in the context of End - Users. This category brings along with it the following characteristics.</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt; color:black"></span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal" style="margin-left:36.0pt; background:white"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#002451">Misstated financial statements due to simple data entry or calculation errors in spreadsheets</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#666666">
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<p class="x_MsoNormal" style="margin-left:36.0pt; background:white"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#002451">Regulatory and compliance violations
</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#666666"></span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal" style="margin-left:36.0pt; background:white"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#002451">Operational impacts and losses due to errors</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#666666"></span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal" style="margin-left:36.0pt; background:white"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#002451">Loss of time stemming from cumbersome manual processes and calculations that could be automated</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#666666"></span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal" style="margin-left:36.0pt; background:white"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#002451">Data redundancy and version control</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#666666"></span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal" style="margin-left:36.0pt; background:white"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#002451">Lack of recovery or forensic capabilities</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#666666"></span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal" style="margin-left:36.0pt; background:white"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#002451">Higher risk of fraud</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#666666"></span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal" style="margin-left:36.0pt; background:white"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#002451">Redoubtable Audit findings due to lack of control</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#666666"></span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; color:black">The serious challenges are:</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; color:black">#1: Technology Push to address these concerns is not viable due to economic reasons. The End - Users would</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; color:black"> be with very limited technology options that are several notches below the bleeding - edge ones.</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; color:black">#2: Stern Regulatory measures such as the ones being hinted are likely to be counter - productive.</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; color:black">Admittedly, the dumb machines and devices reached the end-users much faster than anyone ever expected. A methodology to educate them in that many numbers is frankly beyond my ken at the moment. </span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; color:black"> </span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; color:black">Persuasiveness and Negotiations are on the top of the stack in my mind.</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; color:black"> </span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; color:black">Your thoughts..</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; color:black">Sincerely,</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; color:black"> </span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; color:black">Gopal T V</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#201F1E; background:white">0 9840121302</span><span style="font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#201F1E"><br>
</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt; color:black"><a href="https://vidwan.inflibnet.ac.in/profile/57545" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; background:white">https://vidwan.inflibnet.ac.in/profile/57545</span></a></span><span style="font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#201F1E"><br>
</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt; color:black"><a href="https://www.facebook.com/gopal.tadepalli" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; background:white">https://www.facebook.com/gopal.tadepalli</span></a></span><span style="font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif; color:#201F1E"><br>
<span style="background:white">++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++</span><br>
<span style="background:white">Dr. T V Gopal</span><br>
<span style="background:white">Professor</span><br>
<span style="background:white">Department of Computer Science and Engineering</span><br>
<span style="background:white">College of Engineering</span><br>
<span style="background:white">Anna University</span><br>
<span style="background:white">Chennai - 600 025, INDIA</span><br>
<span style="background:white">Ph : (Off) 22351723 Extn. 3340</span><br>
<span style="background:white"> (Res) 24454753</span><br>
<span style="background:white">++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++</span></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt; color:black"></span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><b><span style="color:black">From:</span></b><span style="color:black"> CPWG <<a href="mailto:cpwg-bounces@icann.org">cpwg-bounces@icann.org</a>> on behalf of Jonathan Zuck via CPWG <<a href="mailto:cpwg@icann.org">cpwg@icann.org</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> 21 April 2023 02:23<br>
<b>To:</b> mike palage.com <<a href="mailto:mike@palage.com">mike@palage.com</a>>; Zak Muscovitch <<a href="mailto:zak@muscovitch.com">zak@muscovitch.com</a>>; Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <<a href="mailto:ocl@gih.com">ocl@gih.com</a>>; Evan Leibovitch <<a href="mailto:evan@telly.org">evan@telly.org</a>>;
CPWG <<a href="mailto:cpwg@icann.org">cpwg@icann.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users</span> </p>
<div>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"> </p>
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<div>
<p class="x_MsoNormal">My comedy is broadly funny Mike! </p>
<div>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div id="x_x_ms-outlook-mobile-signature">
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><b>Jonathan Zuck</b> </p>
<div>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><i>Director</i>, Future of Work Project</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_MsoNormal">Innovators Network Foundation</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><a href="http://www.InnovatorsNetwork.org">www.InnovatorsNetwork.org</a></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
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<div class="x_MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center">
<hr size="2" width="98%" align="center">
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<div id="x_x_divRplyFwdMsg">
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><b><span style="color:black">From:</span></b><span style="color:black"> mike palage.com <<a href="mailto:mike@palage.com">mike@palage.com</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 20, 2023 4:47:14 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Jonathan Zuck <<a href="mailto:JZuck@innovatorsnetwork.org">JZuck@innovatorsnetwork.org</a>>; Zak Muscovitch <<a href="mailto:zak@muscovitch.com">zak@muscovitch.com</a>>; Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <<a href="mailto:ocl@gih.com">ocl@gih.com</a>>; Evan
Leibovitch <<a href="mailto:evan@telly.org">evan@telly.org</a>>; CPWG <<a href="mailto:cpwg@icann.org">cpwg@icann.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users</span> </p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"> </p>
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<div>
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Jonathan,</span></p>
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Perhaps you may want to stick to making your short films. You are much more in your comedic swim lane with that content </span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Segoe UI Emoji",sans-serif">😊</span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Are there any recent videos that you can share? They always seem to bring a smile to my face, although your short western is still my all-time favorite.</span></p>
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Best regards,</span></p>
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Michael</span></p>
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none; border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><b><span lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US"> Jonathan Zuck <<a href="mailto:JZuck@innovatorsnetwork.org">JZuck@innovatorsnetwork.org</a>>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 20, 2023 4:42 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Zak Muscovitch <<a href="mailto:zak@muscovitch.com">zak@muscovitch.com</a>>; mike palage.com <<a href="mailto:mike@palage.com">mike@palage.com</a>>; Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <<a href="mailto:ocl@gih.com">ocl@gih.com</a>>; Evan Leibovitch <<a href="mailto:evan@telly.org">evan@telly.org</a>>;
CPWG <<a href="mailto:cpwg@icann.org">cpwg@icann.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Oh, sorry about that. I thought George was one of yours. I suppose no one really wants to take responsibility for him. Honestly, I was really just trying to tease Evan. J
</span></p>
<div>
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
<div id="x_x_x_ms-outlook-mobile-signature">
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><b><span lang="EN-US">Jonathan Zuck</span></b><span lang="EN-US">
</span></p>
<div>
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><i><span lang="EN-US">Director</span></i><span lang="EN-US">, Future of Work Project</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Innovators Network Foundation</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"><a href="http://www.InnovatorsNetwork.org">www.InnovatorsNetwork.org</a></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div class="x_MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center"><span lang="EN-US">
<hr size="2" width="98%" align="center">
</span></div>
<div id="x_x_x_divRplyFwdMsg">
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="color:black">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="color:black"> Zak Muscovitch <<a href="mailto:zak@muscovitch.com">zak@muscovitch.com</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 20, 2023 4:36:47 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Jonathan Zuck <<a href="mailto:JZuck@innovatorsnetwork.org">JZuck@innovatorsnetwork.org</a>>; mike palage.com <<a href="mailto:mike@palage.com">mike@palage.com</a>>; Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <<a href="mailto:ocl@gih.com">ocl@gih.com</a>>; Evan Leibovitch
<<a href="mailto:evan@telly.org">evan@telly.org</a>>; CPWG <<a href="mailto:cpwg@icann.org">cpwg@icann.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users</span><span lang="EN-US">
</span></p>
<div>
<p class="x_xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Your apology is accepted. Please note however, that it was not a member of the ICA who made any “outcry” and therefore your statement that you “look forward to ICA's civil and rational evaluation of this outcry
<i>by one of its members</i>”, is factually incorrect. </span></p>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Yours truly,</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Zak Muscovitch</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">General Counsel, ICA</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<div>
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<div>
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<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal" style="background:white"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif; color:#222222">Muscovitch Law P.C.</span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal" style="background:white"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif; color:#222222"><a href="mailto:zak@muscovitch.com" target="_blank"><span style="color:#1155CC">zak@muscovitch.com</span></a></span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal" style="background:white"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif; color:#222222">1-866-654-7129</span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal" style="background:white"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif; color:#222222">416-924-5084</span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal" style="background:white"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif; color:#222222"><a href="http://www.trademarks-canada.com/" target="_blank"><span style="color:#1155CC">http://www.trademarks-canada.com/</span></a></span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal" style="background:white"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif; color:#222222"><a href="https://www.muscovitch.com/" target="_blank"><span style="color:#1155CC">https://www.muscovitch.com/</span></a></span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal" style="background:white"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif; color:#222222"><a href="https://dnattorney.com/" target="_blank"><span style="color:#1155CC">https://dnattorney.com/</span></a></span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal" style="background:white"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif; color:#222222"> </span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
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<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
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<div style="border:none; border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><b><span lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US"> Jonathan Zuck <<a href="mailto:JZuck@innovatorsnetwork.org">JZuck@innovatorsnetwork.org</a>>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 20, 2023 4:28 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Zak Muscovitch <<a href="mailto:zak@muscovitch.com">zak@muscovitch.com</a>>; mike palage.com <<a href="mailto:mike@palage.com">mike@palage.com</a>>; Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <<a href="mailto:ocl@gih.com">ocl@gih.com</a>>; Evan Leibovitch <<a href="mailto:evan@telly.org">evan@telly.org</a>>;
CPWG <<a href="mailto:cpwg@icann.org">cpwg@icann.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Oh Hi Zak. Been a minute. Sorry, I was really just trying to make a joke and engaged in some hyperbole...perhaps a bit like the domain industry does when their interests are at stake...but that's neither here nor
there. No real offense intended. I look forward to ICA's civil and rational evaluation of this outcry by one of its members.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Jonathan </span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
<div id="x_x_x_x_ms-outlook-mobile-signature">
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><b><span lang="EN-US">Jonathan Zuck</span></b><span lang="EN-US">
</span></p>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><i><span lang="EN-US">Director</span></i><span lang="EN-US">, Future of Work Project</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Innovators Network Foundation</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"><a href="http://www.InnovatorsNetwork.org">www.InnovatorsNetwork.org</a></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div class="x_MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center"><span lang="EN-US">
<hr size="1" width="98%" align="center">
</span></div>
<div id="x_x_x_x_divRplyFwdMsg">
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="color:black">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="color:black"> Zak Muscovitch <<a href="mailto:zak@muscovitch.com">zak@muscovitch.com</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 20, 2023 4:19:33 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Jonathan Zuck <<a href="mailto:JZuck@innovatorsnetwork.org">JZuck@innovatorsnetwork.org</a>>; mike palage.com <<a href="mailto:mike@palage.com">mike@palage.com</a>>; Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <<a href="mailto:ocl@gih.com">ocl@gih.com</a>>; Evan Leibovitch
<<a href="mailto:evan@telly.org">evan@telly.org</a>>; CPWG <<a href="mailto:cpwg@icann.org">cpwg@icann.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users</span><span lang="EN-US">
</span></p>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Jonathan, I don’t appreciate your sentiment of “hating domainers”. It’s not conducive to civil discussion amongst stakeholders, and in any event it is an overly broad generalization without justification. Moreover,
attributing Evan's concern to being "spun up by domainers" is another unjustified generalization. </span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Zak Muscovitch</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">General Counsel, ICA</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
<div id="x_x_x_x_x_mail-editor-reference-message-container">
<div class="x_MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center"><span lang="EN-US">
<hr size="1" width="98%" align="center">
</span></div>
<div id="x_x_x_x_x_divRplyFwdMsg">
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><b><span lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US"> CPWG <<a href="mailto:cpwg-bounces@icann.org">cpwg-bounces@icann.org</a>> on behalf of Jonathan Zuck via CPWG <<a href="mailto:cpwg@icann.org">cpwg@icann.org</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 20, 2023 4:12 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> mike palage.com <<a href="mailto:mike@palage.com">mike@palage.com</a>>; Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <<a href="mailto:ocl@gih.com">ocl@gih.com</a>>; Evan Leibovitch <<a href="mailto:evan@telly.org">evan@telly.org</a>>; CPWG <<a href="mailto:cpwg@icann.org">cpwg@icann.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users </span></p>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Yeah, this is much ado about nothing. It's not like some contract can give a government permission to seize a domain. Sigh. This is just so ICANN can't come after Verisign ( and PIR etc) for accommodating a court
order.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">For someone who hates the domainers, even more than me, Evan is sure spun up by them!</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
<div id="x_x_x_x_x_ms-outlook-mobile-signature">
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><b><span lang="EN-US">Jonathan Zuck</span></b><span lang="EN-US">
</span></p>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><i><span lang="EN-US">Director</span></i><span lang="EN-US">, Future of Work Project</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Innovators Network Foundation</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"><a href="http://www.InnovatorsNetwork.org">www.InnovatorsNetwork.org</a></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div class="x_MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center"><span lang="EN-US">
<hr size="1" width="98%" align="center">
</span></div>
<div id="x_x_x_x_x_divRplyFwdMsg">
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="color:black">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="color:black"> CPWG <<a href="mailto:cpwg-bounces@icann.org">cpwg-bounces@icann.org</a>> on behalf of mike palage.com via CPWG <<a href="mailto:cpwg@icann.org">cpwg@icann.org</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 20, 2023 3:56:38 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <<a href="mailto:ocl@gih.com">ocl@gih.com</a>>; Evan Leibovitch <<a href="mailto:evan@telly.org">evan@telly.org</a>>; CPWG <<a href="mailto:cpwg@icann.org">cpwg@icann.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users</span><span lang="EN-US">
</span></p>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">Hello Olivier,</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">Can you provide a public reference to the thread or email list? I am a sucker for subscribing to a good mailing list.</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">That being said I would agree with John’s statement. As someone who has consulted with many registry operators over the last two decades, the language in the .COM and the now proposed .NET registry
agreement is not inconsistent with standards provisions across the industry.</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">Sadly, ICANN only requires Verisign to post its Registry/Registrar agreements. However, I was able to quickly find this legal provision from EURid in connection with .EU registrations, see
<a href="https://eurid.eu/d/7556497/Terms_and_Conditions_EN.pdf">https://eurid.eu/d/7556497/Terms_and_Conditions_EN.pdf</a></span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">Section 6.4 - <span style="color:black; background:yellow">
The Registry shall be entitled to immediately suspend or cancel the Domain</span></span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:black; background:yellow">Name when the Registrant is in breach of the Rules.</span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">Section 3. OBLIGATIONS OF THE REGISTRANT</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">Throughout the Term, the Registrant has the following obligations:</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">1. As referred to in the Registration Policy, to keep its contact information accurate, complete, and up-to-date, both (i) with the Registrar with whom the Registrant has entered into an Agreement
and (ii) with the Registry (via the Registrar). Moreover, the Registrant represents and warrants that any email address communicated to the Registry shall be a functioning e-mail</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">address;</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">2. To use the Domain Name in such a way that does not violate any third-party rights, applicable laws, or regulations, including discrimination on the basis of race, language, sex, religion,
or political view;</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">3. Not to use the Domain Name (i) in bad faith or (ii) for
<span style="color:black; background:yellow">any unlawful purpose</span>.</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">Section 4. REPRESENTATIONS AND WARRANTIES OF THE REGISTRANT</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">The Registrant represents and warrants that:</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">1. it meets the Eligibility Criteria, and it shall inform the Registry when it ceases to meet such conditions via its Registrar;</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">2. all information provided to the Registry during the Domain Name registration process is true, complete, and accurate;</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">3. the Domain Name registration is made in good faith,
<span style="color:black; background:yellow">for a lawful purpose</span>, and does not infringe the rights of any third party;</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">4. the Domain Name is not contrary to public policy or morality (e.g. is not obscene or offensive), and is not unlawful;</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">5. throughout the Term, it shall abide by these Terms and Conditions and any and all applicable Rules.</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">Therefore while the Verisign lawyers were a bit verbose our friends at EURid were much more succinct.
</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">Net Net – I personally am not losing any sleep over the proposed mark-up to the RRA. That being said there are A LOT of other provisions in the existing/proposed .NET agreement that are giving
me angst, so please tune in next Wednesday when Bill and I share our initial assessment and concerns.
</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">Best regards,</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">Michael</span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
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<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><b><span lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US"> CPWG <<a href="mailto:cpwg-bounces@icann.org">cpwg-bounces@icann.org</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond via CPWG<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 20, 2023 3:28 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Evan Leibovitch <<a href="mailto:evan@telly.org">evan@telly.org</a>>; CPWG <<a href="mailto:cpwg@icann.org">cpwg@icann.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users</span></p>
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<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin-right:0cm; margin-bottom:12.0pt; margin-left:0cm">
<span lang="EN-US">Forgot the reference:<br>
<a href="https://itp.cdn.icann.org/en/files/registry-agreements/com/com-amend-3-pdf-27mar20-en.pdf">https://itp.cdn.icann.org/en/files/registry-agreements/com/com-amend-3-pdf-27mar20-en.pdf</a></span></p>
<div>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">On 20/04/2023 20:26, Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond wrote:</span></p>
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<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt; margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin-right:0cm; margin-bottom:12.0pt; margin-left:0cm">
<span lang="EN-US">Worth noting: John Levine points out on another mailing list that the changes are the same as those already integrated in the .COM Registry Agreement 3 years ago and that did not cause as many ripples back then.<br>
<br>
He also mentions that governments seize gTLD domains all the time when they get a suitable
<br>
court order. But of course I guess this is all in the details.<br>
<br>
Kindest regards,<br>
<br>
Olivier</span></p>
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<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">On 20/04/2023 17:12, Evan Leibovitch via CPWG wrote:</span></p>
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<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt; margin-bottom:5.0pt">
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<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif; color:#0B5394"><a href="https://freespeech.com/2023/04/19/red-alert-icann-and-verisign-proposal-would-allow-any-government-in-the-world-to-seize-domain-names/">https://freespeech.com/2023/04/19/red-alert-icann-and-verisign-proposal-would-allow-any-government-in-the-world-to-seize-domain-names/</a></span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
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<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif; color:#0B5394"> </span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
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<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif; color:#0B5394">Let's briefly put aside the boasting about ALAC's incremental involvement in the trivial agendas set by ICANN's vested interests. Here's
a real example of an issue that can negatively affect end-users. The aims of the proposed modification may be laudable, but there's too much room for arbitrariness and too much potential to curb political speech unwanted by a government.</span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
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<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif; color:#0B5394"> </span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
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<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif; color:#0B5394">BTW ... Why was this not already flagged by ALAC as cause for concern? Why did I have to find out about this in the media rather than from
the inside. Was ALAC intending to ignore it?</span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
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<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif; color:#0B5394"> </span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
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<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif; color:#0B5394">This is EXACTLY what I'm talking about. ALAC is obsessed with the trivial and the self-absorbed, but asleep during the issues that actually
affect the constituency we're supposed to serve.</span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
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<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif; color:#0B5394"> </span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
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<div>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif; color:#0B5394">Does ALAC have what it takes to fight for the public interest on something that actually matters?</span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
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<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif; color:#0B5394">Is it capable of balancing the various intertwining issues? If the CPWG meets on this issue I'll be there.</span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
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<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif; color:#0B5394"><br clear="all">
</span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
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<div>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US">Evan Leibovitch, </span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:9.5pt">Toronto Canada</span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:9.5pt">@evanleibovitch / @el56</span><span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
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<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin-right:0cm; margin-bottom:12.0pt; margin-left:0cm">
<span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">_______________________________________________</span></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">CPWG mailing list</span></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US"><a href="mailto:CPWG@icann.org">CPWG@icann.org</a></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US"><a href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cpwg">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cpwg</a></span></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US"> </span></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">_______________________________________________</span></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">By submitting your personal data, you consent to the processing of your personal data for purposes of subscribing to this mailing list accordance with the ICANN Privacy Policy (<a href="https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy">https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy</a>) and the website Terms of Service (<a href="https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos">https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos</a>). You can visit the Mailman link above to change your membership status or configuration, including unsubscribing, setting digest-style delivery or disabling delivery altogether (e.g., for a vacation), and so on.</span></pre>
</blockquote>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin:0cm"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
</blockquote>
<p class="x_xxxxxmsonormal" style="margin-right:0cm; margin-bottom:12.0pt; margin-left:0cm">
<span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">-- </span></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond, PhD</span></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US"><a href="http://www.gih.com/ocl.html">http://www.gih.com/ocl.html</a></span></pre>
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