[CWG-Stewardship] Transition ProposalHi, v.3 -- Edits due on Sunday at 23:59 UTC
Avri Doria
avri at acm.org
Mon Jun 8 16:23:12 UTC 2015
Hi,
I agree that we should not be creating yet another mechanism and wheher
we reset timers of not, we do not create something new to handle a post
SCWG review.
To Chuck's point, if we leave the periodicity of reviews post a SCWG to
the SCWG, they could decide that 5 years is much too frequent. I am
fine with leaving the future open to the future on issue of timer
duration if others are.
In recommending a return to Transition rules, I hoped I was recommending
something simple that required few extra words in the proposal. Just as
I believe we should not be adding new mechanisms, I also believe that we
should not be adding a lot of complicating text at this point.
avri
On 08-Jun-15 10:53, Matthew Shears wrote:
> Thanks Greg - I think this makes sense. On the Follow-up Reviews, I
> agree that the PIFR should not be accelerated to do it, but why
> wouldn't IFR still undertake the review? I don't think we should be
> creating a new body to do so.
>
> On 6/8/2015 10:42 AM, Greg Shatan wrote:
>> My suggestion is that the periodic IFRs should stay on the same
>> schedule (like Olympics or World Cups or Presidential elections)
>> regardless of any SIFRs. So, if the transition takes places in 2015,
>> the first (2 year) IFR would take place in 2017, and then every 5
>> years thereafter (in this example, 2022, 2027, 2032, 2037, etc.),
>> unless a new IFO is put in place, replacing PTI. In this case, the
>> clock should reset, so that there is a 2 year IFR, followed by
>> successive 5 year IFRs (as above).
>>
>> *Follow-up Reviews: *SIFRs are different than PIFRs because they are
>> triggered by a material deficiency, and they are aimed at resolving
>> that deficiency. Therefore, I suggest that after a SIFR (or a SCWG
>> that does not result in a new IFO), a targeted follow-up should take
>> place to determine whether the deficiency was in fact satisfactorily
>> resolved. A full PIFR is not the right tool to do so, and should not
>> be accelerated to serve as such. I would suggest that this Follow-up
>> Review should take place 1 year after the end of the SIFR or SCWG
>> process.
>>
>> Greg
>>
>> On Mon, Jun 8, 2015 at 9:36 AM, Gomes, Chuck <cgomes at verisign.com
>> <mailto:cgomes at verisign.com>> wrote:
>>
>> I definitely think we should keep it as simple as possible and
>> maybe having the SCWG make recommendations as to any clock
>> resetting is one way to keep it simpler. I definitely don't
>> think that periodic reviews should ever happen less frequently
>> than every five years.
>>
>> Chuck
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>> <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>
>> [mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>> <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>] On Behalf Of Avri Doria
>> Sent: Sunday, June 07, 2015 7:32 PM
>> To: cwg-stewardship at icann.org <mailto:cwg-stewardship at icann.org>
>> Subject: Re: [CWG-Stewardship] Transition ProposalHi, v.3 --
>> Edits due on Sunday at 23:59 UTC
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> that was exactly what I proposed.
>>
>> SCWG -> reset IFR timer.
>>
>> cheers
>>
>> avri
>>
>>
>> On 07-Jun-15 18:30, Greg Shatan wrote:
>> > I think we are complicating things with the timing of reviews. It
>> > will be more predictable to have the periodic reviews stay on
>> > schedule, regardless of a SIFR. I would suggest that the next
>> > periodic IFR (PIFR?) after a SIFR should specifically examine
>> whether
>> > the remediation that came out of the SIFR continued to work in a
>> > satisfactory manner.
>> >
>> > The only exception would be if a SIFR resulting in SCWG and
>> ultimately
>> > in a new IFO (replacing PTI). In this case, the new IFO should be
>> > subject to a PIFR two years after commencing operations.
>> >
>> > Greg
>> >
>> > On Sun, Jun 7, 2015 at 12:45 PM, James Gannon
>> <james at cyberinvasion.net <mailto:james at cyberinvasion.net>
>> > <mailto:james at cyberinvasion.net
>> <mailto:james at cyberinvasion.net>>> wrote:
>> >
>> > I would support the SCWG making a recommendation on it as the
>> > landscape may change post an SCWG depending on the outcome. The
>> > SCWG would be in the best position to make an informed fact
>> based
>> > decision at that time rather than us making it based on
>> > hypotheticals now.
>> >
>> > -James
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>> <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>
>> > <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>> <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>>
>> > [mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>> <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>
>> > <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>> <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>>] On Behalf Of Avri Doria
>> > Sent: Sunday, June 07, 2015 4:29 PM
>> > To: cwg-stewardship at icann.org
>> <mailto:cwg-stewardship at icann.org>
>> <mailto:cwg-stewardship at icann.org <mailto:cwg-stewardship at icann.org>>
>> > Subject: Re: [CWG-Stewardship] Transition Proposal v.3 -- Edits
>> > due on Sunday at 23:59 UTC
>> >
>> > Hi
>> >
>> > Sorry for the confusion.
>> >
>> > I was asking whether we consider resetting the IFR timer
>> for post
>> > SCWG.
>> >
>> > We had the conversation about post SIFR and lots of
>> arguments were
>> > made both ways, with neither prevailing; so I left that
>> issue alone.
>> >
>> > The idea about doing it post SCWG, is that even if the SCWG
>> were
>> > to result in no-change, whatever would have been going on
>> at the
>> > time, would have been serious enough for the SCWG to have been
>> > triggered. It therefore seems that this would be a good
>> time to
>> > rest the clock back to time 0 (i.e. this transition).
>> >
>> > On the other hand, perhaps this decision could be left to
>> the SCWG
>> > to recommend, just as a SIFR or IFR could recommend a
>> changed timing.
>> >
>> > avri
>> >
>> >
>> > On 07-Jun-15 11:14, Gomes, Chuck wrote:
>> > > Avri,
>> > >
>> > > Regarding the clock for periodic IFRs related to SIFRs,
>> let me
>> > make sure I understand what you are suggesting. Am I
>> correct that
>> > you are suggesting that after an SIFR the entire clock would be
>> > reset so that the next periodic IFR would occur two years later
>> > and then the (no more than) 5 year periodic review cycle would
>> > kick in again? If so, then the only concern I have is a
>> situation
>> > illustration by this possible scenario:
>> > > - The initial 2-year periodic review happens.
>> > > - A SIFR occurs 4 years after the initial 2-year
>> periodic
>> > review.
>> > > - A new 2-year periodic review happens 2 years
>> after the SIFR.
>> > > In this case there would be six years or more between
>> periodic
>> > reviews, which would violate our intent that periodic reviews
>> > occur no less frequently than five years.
>> > >
>> > > Because periodic review cover items different than in
>> SIFRs, I
>> > think we should fix this, assuming I am understanding your
>> > recommendation correctly, and I think it should be easily
>> fixable
>> > with some adjustments to wording. Would a qualifier, like the
>> > following work: "In case an SIFR occurs close to the end of a
>> > 5-year period after the last periodic review, the periodic
>> review
>> > should still occur and a 2-year periodic review should
>> occur after
>> > the 5-year periodic review."
>> > >
>> > > I am not sure my qualifying language is the best but I at
>> least
>> > wanted to try to suggest something.
>> > >
>> > > Hope this makes sense but if it doesn't please let me know.
>> > >
>> > > Chuck
>> > >
>> > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > From: cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>> <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>
>> > <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>> <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>>
>> > > [mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>> <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>
>> > <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>> <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>>] On Behalf Of Avri Doria
>> > > Sent: Saturday, June 06, 2015 12:07 PM
>> > > To: cwg-stewardship at icann.org
>> <mailto:cwg-stewardship at icann.org>
>> <mailto:cwg-stewardship at icann.org <mailto:cwg-stewardship at icann.org>>
>> > > Subject: Re: [CWG-Stewardship] Transition Proposal v.3 --
>> Edits
>> > due on
>> > > Sunday at 23:59 UTC
>> > >
>> > > Hi,
>> > >
>> > > On a partial reread, I have the following comments.
>> > > I do agree with Grace's comment that we are almost there.
>> > >
>> > > On 05-Jun-15 00:07, Grace Abuhamad wrote:
>> > >> Dear all,
>> > >>
>> > >> Attached is the updated proposal. This version includes
>> the edits
>> > >> listed below. *Your comments are requested and welcome
>> until Sunday
>> > >> 23:59 UTC.* If you don't have time to read the whole
>> proposal, I've
>> > >> highlighted specific areas in the document that require
>> feedback.
>> > >> * Footnote (p.65): DT-N to respond to Sidley about
>> status of
>> > >> footnote
>> > >>
>> > > - i do not understand footnote 51 in the context of the
>> current
>> > report. It is a vestige of a time before we discussed the
>> IFR in
>> > detail. I think it should be removed.
>> > >
>> > >> * Section VI edits should be reviewed by CWG (Avri
>> perhaps?)
>> > >>
>> > > seems fine to me.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > --- Does Annex H need to change based on changes made
>> in para 133
>> > >
>> > > --- An issue we discussed but not sure we closed on.
>> > >
>> > > IFR Clock reset after any SCWG. (and understanding that we
>> > could not
>> > > come to consensus of changing the periodicity after an SIFR)
>> > >
>> > > I think we need to reset the clock after any SCWG, no
>> matter what
>> > > outcome it may select. If something was important enough
>> to warrant
>> > > an SCWG, its outcome needs to be reviewed 2 years later -
>> even
>> > in case
>> > > of a decision of no change)
>> > >
>> > > this would require changing: 299 top row 2nd col.
>> > >
>> > >> Initially, two years, then moving to every five years
>> > >>
>> > > to
>> > >
>> > > Initially and after an SCWG, two years, then moving to an
>> > interval of
>> > > no more than five years
>> > >
>> > > (the second bit for consistency with other word in the doc)
>> > >
>> > > It might also require insertion of something like the
>> following
>> > after
>> > > 126 & 385
>> > >
>> > > # After the completion of a SCWG process, the IFR
>> periodic clock
>> > will be reset to its initial state of first IFR after 2 years
>> > followed by a period of no more that five years for
>> subsequent IFR.
>> > >
>> > > thanks
>> > >
>> > > avri
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > ---
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> --
> Matthew Shears
> Global Internet Policy and Human Rights
> Center for Democracy & Technology (CDT)
> + 44 (0)771 247 2987
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