[CWG-Stewardship] Transition ProposalHi, v.3 -- Edits due on Sunday at 23:59 UTC

Avri Doria avri at acm.org
Mon Jun 8 16:23:12 UTC 2015


Hi,

I agree that we should not be creating yet another mechanism and wheher
we reset timers of not, we do not create something new to handle a post
SCWG review.

To Chuck's point, if we leave the periodicity of reviews post a SCWG to
the SCWG, they could decide that 5 years is much too frequent.   I am
fine with leaving the future open to the future on issue of timer
duration if others are.

In recommending a return to Transition rules, I hoped I was recommending
something simple that required few extra words in the proposal.  Just as
I believe we should not be adding new mechanisms, I also believe that we
should not be adding a lot of complicating text at this point.

avri


On 08-Jun-15 10:53, Matthew Shears wrote:
> Thanks Greg - I think this makes sense.   On the Follow-up Reviews, I
> agree that the PIFR should not be accelerated to do it, but why
> wouldn't IFR still undertake the review?  I don't think we should be
> creating a new body to do so.
>
> On 6/8/2015 10:42 AM, Greg Shatan wrote:
>> My suggestion is that the periodic IFRs should stay on the same
>> schedule (like Olympics or World Cups or Presidential elections)
>> regardless of any SIFRs.  So, if the transition takes places in 2015,
>> the first (2 year) IFR would take place in 2017, and then every 5
>> years thereafter (in this example, 2022, 2027, 2032, 2037, etc.),
>> unless a new IFO is put in place, replacing PTI.  In this case, the
>> clock should reset, so that there is a 2 year IFR, followed by
>> successive 5 year IFRs (as above).
>>
>> *Follow-up Reviews: *SIFRs are different than PIFRs because they are
>> triggered by a material deficiency, and they are aimed at resolving
>> that deficiency.  Therefore, I suggest that after a SIFR (or a SCWG
>> that does not result in a new IFO), a targeted follow-up should take
>> place to determine whether the deficiency was in fact satisfactorily
>> resolved.  A full PIFR is not the right tool to do so, and should not
>> be accelerated to serve as such.  I would suggest that this Follow-up
>> Review should take place 1 year after the end of the SIFR or SCWG
>> process.
>>
>> Greg
>>
>> On Mon, Jun 8, 2015 at 9:36 AM, Gomes, Chuck <cgomes at verisign.com
>> <mailto:cgomes at verisign.com>> wrote:
>>
>>     I definitely think we should keep it as simple as possible and
>>     maybe having the SCWG make recommendations as to any clock
>>     resetting is one way to keep it simpler.  I definitely don't
>>     think that periodic reviews should ever happen less frequently
>>     than every five years.
>>
>>     Chuck
>>
>>     -----Original Message-----
>>     From: cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>>     <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>
>>     [mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>>     <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>] On Behalf Of Avri Doria
>>     Sent: Sunday, June 07, 2015 7:32 PM
>>     To: cwg-stewardship at icann.org <mailto:cwg-stewardship at icann.org>
>>     Subject: Re: [CWG-Stewardship] Transition ProposalHi, v.3 --
>>     Edits due on Sunday at 23:59 UTC
>>
>>     Hi,
>>
>>     that was exactly what I proposed.
>>
>>     SCWG -> reset IFR timer.
>>
>>     cheers
>>
>>     avri
>>
>>
>>     On 07-Jun-15 18:30, Greg Shatan wrote:
>>     > I think we are complicating things with the timing of reviews.  It
>>     > will be more predictable to have the periodic reviews stay on
>>     > schedule, regardless of a SIFR.  I would suggest that the next
>>     > periodic IFR (PIFR?) after a SIFR should specifically examine
>>     whether
>>     > the remediation that came out of the SIFR continued to work in a
>>     > satisfactory manner.
>>     >
>>     > The only exception would be if a SIFR resulting in SCWG and
>>     ultimately
>>     > in a new IFO (replacing PTI).  In this case, the new IFO should be
>>     > subject to a PIFR two years after commencing operations.
>>     >
>>     > Greg
>>     >
>>     > On Sun, Jun 7, 2015 at 12:45 PM, James Gannon
>>     <james at cyberinvasion.net <mailto:james at cyberinvasion.net>
>>     > <mailto:james at cyberinvasion.net
>>     <mailto:james at cyberinvasion.net>>> wrote:
>>     >
>>     >     I would support the SCWG making a recommendation on it as the
>>     >     landscape may change post an SCWG depending on the outcome. The
>>     >     SCWG would be in the best position to make an informed fact
>>     based
>>     >     decision at that time rather than us making it based on
>>     >     hypotheticals now.
>>     >
>>     >     -James
>>     >
>>     >     -----Original Message-----
>>     >     From: cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>>     <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>
>>     >     <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>>     <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>>
>>     >     [mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>>     <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>
>>     >     <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>>     <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>>] On Behalf Of Avri Doria
>>     >     Sent: Sunday, June 07, 2015 4:29 PM
>>     >     To: cwg-stewardship at icann.org
>>     <mailto:cwg-stewardship at icann.org>
>>     <mailto:cwg-stewardship at icann.org <mailto:cwg-stewardship at icann.org>>
>>     >     Subject: Re: [CWG-Stewardship] Transition Proposal v.3 -- Edits
>>     >     due on Sunday at 23:59 UTC
>>     >
>>     >     Hi
>>     >
>>     >     Sorry for the confusion.
>>     >
>>     >     I was asking whether we consider resetting the IFR timer
>>     for post
>>     >     SCWG.
>>     >
>>     >     We had the conversation about post SIFR and lots of
>>     arguments were
>>     >     made both ways, with neither prevailing; so I left that
>>     issue alone.
>>     >
>>     >     The idea about doing it post SCWG, is that even if the SCWG
>>     were
>>     >     to result in no-change, whatever would have been going on
>>     at the
>>     >     time, would have been serious enough for the SCWG to have been
>>     >     triggered.  It therefore seems that this would be a good
>>     time to
>>     >     rest the clock back to time 0 (i.e. this transition).
>>     >
>>     >     On the other hand, perhaps this decision could be left to
>>     the SCWG
>>     >     to recommend, just as a SIFR or IFR could recommend a
>>     changed timing.
>>     >
>>     >     avri
>>     >
>>     >
>>     >     On 07-Jun-15 11:14, Gomes, Chuck wrote:
>>     >     > Avri,
>>     >     >
>>     >     > Regarding the clock for periodic IFRs related to SIFRs,
>>     let me
>>     >     make sure I understand what you are suggesting.  Am I
>>     correct that
>>     >     you are suggesting that after an SIFR the entire clock would be
>>     >     reset so that the next periodic IFR would occur two years later
>>     >     and then the (no more than) 5 year periodic review cycle would
>>     >     kick in again?  If so, then the only concern I have is a
>>     situation
>>     >     illustration by this possible scenario:
>>     >     >       -  The initial 2-year periodic review happens.
>>     >     >       -  A SIFR occurs 4 years after the initial 2-year
>>     periodic
>>     >     review.
>>     >     >       - A new 2-year periodic review happens 2 years
>>     after the SIFR.
>>     >     > In this case there would be six years or more between
>>     periodic
>>     >     reviews, which would violate our intent that periodic reviews
>>     >     occur no less frequently than five years.
>>     >     >
>>     >     > Because periodic review cover items different than in
>>     SIFRs, I
>>     >     think we should fix this, assuming I am understanding your
>>     >     recommendation correctly, and I think it should be easily
>>     fixable
>>     >     with some adjustments to wording.  Would a qualifier, like the
>>     >     following work:  "In case an SIFR occurs close to the end of a
>>     >     5-year period after the last periodic review, the periodic
>>     review
>>     >     should still occur and a 2-year periodic review should
>>     occur after
>>     >     the 5-year periodic review."
>>     >     >
>>     >     > I am not sure my qualifying language is the best but I at
>>     least
>>     >     wanted to try to suggest something.
>>     >     >
>>     >     > Hope this makes sense but if it doesn't please let me know.
>>     >     >
>>     >     > Chuck
>>     >     >
>>     >     > -----Original Message-----
>>     >     > From: cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>>     <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>
>>     >     <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>>     <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>>
>>     >     > [mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>>     <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>
>>     >     <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org
>>     <mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces at icann.org>>] On Behalf Of Avri Doria
>>     >     > Sent: Saturday, June 06, 2015 12:07 PM
>>     >     > To: cwg-stewardship at icann.org
>>     <mailto:cwg-stewardship at icann.org>
>>     <mailto:cwg-stewardship at icann.org <mailto:cwg-stewardship at icann.org>>
>>     >     > Subject: Re: [CWG-Stewardship] Transition Proposal v.3 --
>>     Edits
>>     >     due on
>>     >     > Sunday at 23:59 UTC
>>     >     >
>>     >     > Hi,
>>     >     >
>>     >     > On a partial reread, I have the following comments.
>>     >     > I do agree with Grace's comment that we are almost there.
>>     >     >
>>     >     > On 05-Jun-15 00:07, Grace Abuhamad wrote:
>>     >     >> Dear all,
>>     >     >>
>>     >     >> Attached is the updated proposal. This version includes
>>     the edits
>>     >     >> listed below. *Your comments are requested and welcome
>>     until Sunday
>>     >     >> 23:59 UTC.* If you don't have time to read the whole
>>     proposal, I've
>>     >     >> highlighted specific areas in the document that require
>>     feedback.
>>     >     >>   * Footnote (p.65): DT-N to respond to Sidley about
>>     status of
>>     >     >> footnote
>>     >     >>
>>     >     > -  i do not understand footnote 51 in the context of the
>>     current
>>     >     report.  It is a vestige of a time before we discussed the
>>     IFR in
>>     >     detail.  I think it should be removed.
>>     >     >
>>     >     >>   * Section VI edits should be reviewed by CWG (Avri
>>     perhaps?)
>>     >     >>
>>     >     > seems fine to me.
>>     >     >
>>     >     >
>>     >     >
>>     >     > ---    Does Annex H need to change based on changes made
>>     in para 133
>>     >     >
>>     >     > ---   An issue we discussed but not sure we closed on.
>>     >     >
>>     >     > IFR Clock reset after any SCWG.  (and understanding that we
>>     >     could not
>>     >     > come to consensus of changing the periodicity after an SIFR)
>>     >     >
>>     >     > I think we need to reset the clock after any SCWG, no
>>     matter what
>>     >     > outcome it may select.  If something was important enough
>>     to warrant
>>     >     > an SCWG, its outcome needs to be reviewed 2 years later -
>>     even
>>     >     in case
>>     >     > of a decision of no change)
>>     >     >
>>     >     > this would require changing: 299 top row 2nd col.
>>     >     >
>>     >     >> Initially, two years, then moving to every five years
>>     >     >>
>>     >     > to
>>     >     >
>>     >     > Initially and after an SCWG, two years, then moving to an
>>     >     interval of
>>     >     > no more than five years
>>     >     >
>>     >     > (the second bit for consistency with other word in the doc)
>>     >     >
>>     >     > It might also require insertion of something like the
>>     following
>>     >     after
>>     >     > 126 & 385
>>     >     >
>>     >     > # After the completion of a SCWG process, the IFR
>>     periodic clock
>>     >     will be reset to its initial state of first IFR after 2 years
>>     >     followed by a period of no more that five years for
>>     subsequent IFR.
>>     >     >
>>     >     > thanks
>>     >     >
>>     >     > avri
>>     >     >
>>     >     >
>>     >     >
>>     >     > ---
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> -- 
> Matthew Shears
> Global Internet Policy and Human Rights
> Center for Democracy & Technology (CDT)
> + 44 (0)771 247 2987


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