<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto">Excellent! Count me in. I will try to send a short note tonight. <div><br></div><div>Steve <br><br><div dir="ltr">Sent from my iPhone</div><div dir="ltr"><br><blockquote type="cite">On Aug 18, 2021, at 5:03 PM, Drazek, Keith via Gnso-epdp-team <gnso-epdp-team@icann.org> wrote:<br><br></blockquote></div><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr">
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<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal">Hi all,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">As we work to complete our Final Report, the Leadership team and Staff would like to suggest a very focused bit of additional work related to proposed Rec #3 and the potential standardized data element. This follows from our recent facilitated
conversations and plenary discussions concerning the need to better define the values in a such a data element.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;line-height:16.2pt"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<ol style="margin-top:0in" start="1" type="1">
<li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1">There appears to be momentum to support a standardized data element that MAY be used by Registrars if they choose to differentiate between legal and natural persons, and/or whether
a registration data set contains personal data. That said, based on recent input and discussion, moving this forward to a consensus recommendation appears likely only if the full group agrees that any disclosures or use of the data element(s) would occur within
a restricted system such as SSAD.<o:p></o:p></li></ol>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<ol style="margin-top:0in" start="2" type="1">
<li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1">It has also been suggested that the KIND data element within RDAP, which already exists, could be modified to become fit for purpose. Whether it is or not, additional specificity is
required on how the data element(s) will achieve the purpose of our policy objective. Without that specificity, the benefit of Recommendation #3 may be difficult to define or implement.<o:p></o:p></li></ol>
<p class="MsoListParagraph"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<ol style="margin-top:0in" start="3" type="1">
<li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1">Doing this extra work now depends in part on whether we can reach consensus around the development/use of a standardized data element within a restricted system such as SSAD, so that
may be a gating question to be answered in short order.<o:p></o:p></li></ol>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;line-height:16.2pt"><span class="s2"><b><u>Assignment:</u></b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;line-height:16.2pt"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;line-height:16.2pt">If there is general agreement among the full team that a standardized data element would be used within a restricted system, the small team will develop a proposal that can better inform Recommendation
#3 and, if adopted, better inform the parties who would implement it. As such, for the purpose of this very focused work, the topics of transfer of the data element from Registrar to Registry and the publication of data element(s) to a public directory are
out of scope. If there’s general agreement to proceed, the proposed specific tasks of the small group are:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;line-height:16.2pt"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div style="margin-left:27.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>Is the KIND RDAP data element fit for purpose of differentiation or the indication of whether the registration data contains personal data?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div style="margin-left:27.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>If not, what data element(s) need to be created?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div style="margin-left:27.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>What are the value types for these data element(s) and its respective definition?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div style="margin-left:27.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>Revision of Recommendation #3 text.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div style="margin-left:27.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>Indication of what ICANN Org must do vs. IETF or other standards bodies.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Suggested contributors: I’d like to avoid over-engineering or restricting this small group, but it seems that input from Steve Crocker, Brian King, Volker Greimann, Marc Anderson, Alan Greenberg, and Chris Lewis-Evans would be a great starting
point to develop text for full EPDP team consideration. If anyone else has a strong interest in participating, feel free to let me know during Thursday’s plenary call, but we should try to keep it manageable for scheduling purposes. Staff will also support
the group’s work.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<p style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;line-height:16.2pt"><span class="s2"><b><u>Suggested Timing:</u></b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div style="margin-left:27.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>20 Aug or 21 Aug – first small team meeting<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div style="margin-left:27.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>24 Aug – provide update to plenary<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div style="margin-left:27.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>24,25 Aug – additional meetings as necessary; send output to plenary<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div style="margin-left:27.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>26 Aug – <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Please consider this proposal and come prepared to give initial thoughts/feedback during Thursday’s plenary. There’s some additional context included below.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks in advance!<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Keith<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<p style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;line-height:16.2pt"><span class="s2"><b><u>Appendix Contents:</u></b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div style="margin-left:27.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>Brian King’s email 5 Aug 2021<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div style="margin-left:27.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>RySG Operational Challenge comment<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div style="margin-left:27.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:27.0pt;text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>Steve Crocker Zoom chat comments<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<p style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;line-height:16.2pt"><span class="s6"><b>Appendix:</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;line-height:16.2pt"><span class="s6"><b>Brian King’s email 5 Aug 2021:</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">Hi all, <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">I’d like to share some thoughts on how we could leverage the "kind" attribute in RDAP to convey legal vs. natural registrant data. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">RDAP uses <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__datatracker.ietf.org_doc_html_rfc7095&d=DwMGaQ&c=OGmtg_3SI10Cogwk-ShFiw&r=qQNCXqU_XE2XIdXbawYmk-YDflYH6pd8ffXlzxU37OA&m=ZWAa2OqgTmi7qj2a3LdkCJBk2FgS_bjvOE25EF5aNqc&s=_iCyyozPy8O9rDaJOckHD1vV_7nXvvCL0aDn_2xp5ro&e="><span class="s8"><span style="color:#0563C1">jCard</span></span></a> (a
json version of the <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__datatracker.ietf.org_doc_html_rfc6350&d=DwMGaQ&c=OGmtg_3SI10Cogwk-ShFiw&r=qQNCXqU_XE2XIdXbawYmk-YDflYH6pd8ffXlzxU37OA&m=ZWAa2OqgTmi7qj2a3LdkCJBk2FgS_bjvOE25EF5aNqc&s=WznYXurUATL3BHkfO6vaON88WPD_ZFhqgJB87FrOlJk&e="><span class="s8"><span style="color:#0563C1">vCard</span></span></a> standard)
to convey contact information about individuals and organizations in <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__datatracker.ietf.org_doc_html_rfc7483&d=DwMGaQ&c=OGmtg_3SI10Cogwk-ShFiw&r=qQNCXqU_XE2XIdXbawYmk-YDflYH6pd8ffXlzxU37OA&m=ZWAa2OqgTmi7qj2a3LdkCJBk2FgS_bjvOE25EF5aNqc&s=va8Ii11hnpWYkmiaLkJl4ohY4ip9Pc6Wj2Hkvioxo1Y&e="><span class="s8"><span style="color:#0563C1">json
formatted RDAP Responses</span></span></a>. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">The <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__datatracker.ietf.org_doc_html_rfc6350&d=DwMGaQ&c=OGmtg_3SI10Cogwk-ShFiw&r=qQNCXqU_XE2XIdXbawYmk-YDflYH6pd8ffXlzxU37OA&m=ZWAa2OqgTmi7qj2a3LdkCJBk2FgS_bjvOE25EF5aNqc&s=WznYXurUATL3BHkfO6vaON88WPD_ZFhqgJB87FrOlJk&e="><span class="s8"><span style="color:#0563C1">vCard</span></span></a> spec
(and thus <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__datatracker.ietf.org_doc_html_rfc7095&d=DwMGaQ&c=OGmtg_3SI10Cogwk-ShFiw&r=qQNCXqU_XE2XIdXbawYmk-YDflYH6pd8ffXlzxU37OA&m=ZWAa2OqgTmi7qj2a3LdkCJBk2FgS_bjvOE25EF5aNqc&s=_iCyyozPy8O9rDaJOckHD1vV_7nXvvCL0aDn_2xp5ro&e="><span class="s8"><span style="color:#0563C1">jCard</span></span></a>)
does not mandate or require the inclusion of “kind”. Its inclusion is optional and if it is not present the kind of “individual” is to be assumed. From the <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__datatracker.ietf.org_doc_html_rfc6350&d=DwMGaQ&c=OGmtg_3SI10Cogwk-ShFiw&r=qQNCXqU_XE2XIdXbawYmk-YDflYH6pd8ffXlzxU37OA&m=ZWAa2OqgTmi7qj2a3LdkCJBk2FgS_bjvOE25EF5aNqc&s=WznYXurUATL3BHkfO6vaON88WPD_ZFhqgJB87FrOlJk&e="><span class="s8"><span style="color:#0563C1">vCard</span></span></a> spec: <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__datatracker.ietf.org_doc_html_rfc6350-23section-2D6.1.4&d=DwMGaQ&c=OGmtg_3SI10Cogwk-ShFiw&r=qQNCXqU_XE2XIdXbawYmk-YDflYH6pd8ffXlzxU37OA&m=ZWAa2OqgTmi7qj2a3LdkCJBk2FgS_bjvOE25EF5aNqc&s=VDvAoRZVjaPKNzio98DH4h6BYC3xG9ku7zZXUnxoJBo&e="><span class="s9"><b><span style="color:#0563C1">6.1.4</span></b></span></a><span class="s6"><b>.
KIND</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> Purpose: To specify the kind of object the vCard represents.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> Value type: A single text value.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> Cardinality: *1 <span class="s10"><i>[Exactly one instance per vCard MAY be present.]</i></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> Special notes: The value may be one of the following:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <span class="s6"><b>"individual" for a vCard representing a single person or entity.</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b> This is the default kind of vCard.</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "group" for a vCard representing a group of persons or entities.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> The group's member entities can be other vCards or other types<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> of entities, such as email addresses or web sites. A group<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> vCard will usually contain MEMBER properties to specify the<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> members of the group, but it is not required to. A group vCard<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> without MEMBER properties can be considered an abstract<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> grouping, or one whose members are known empirically (perhaps<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "IETF Participants" or "Republican U.S. Senators").<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> All properties in a group vCard apply to the group as a whole,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> and not to any particular MEMBER. For example, an EMAIL<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> property might specify the address of a mailing list associated<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> with the group, and an IMPP property might refer to a group<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> chat room.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <span class="s6"><b>"org" for a vCard representing an organization. An organization</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b> vCard will not (in fact, MUST NOT) contain MEMBER properties,</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b> and so these are something of a cross between "individual" and</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b> "group". An organization is a single entity, but not a person.</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b> It might represent a business or government, a department or</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b> division within a business or government, a club, an</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b> association, or the like.</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b> All properties in an organization vCard apply to the</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b> organization as a whole, as is the case with a group vCard.</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b> For example, an EMAIL property might specify the address of a</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b> contact point for the organization.</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "location" for a named geographical place. A location vCard will<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> usually contain a GEO property, but it is not required to. A<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> location vCard without a GEO property can be considered an<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> abstract location, or one whose definition is known empirically<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> (perhaps "New England" or "The Seashore").<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> All properties in a location vCard apply to the location<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> itself, and not with any entity that might exist at that<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> location. For example, in a vCard for an office building, an<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ADR property might give the mailing address for the building,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> and a TEL property might specify the telephone number of the<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> receptionist.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> An x-name. vCards MAY include private or experimental values for<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> KIND. Remember that x-name values are not intended for general<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> use and are unlikely to interoperate.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> An iana-token. Additional values may be registered with IANA (see<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__datatracker.ietf.org_doc_html_rfc6350-23section-2D10.3.4&d=DwMGaQ&c=OGmtg_3SI10Cogwk-ShFiw&r=qQNCXqU_XE2XIdXbawYmk-YDflYH6pd8ffXlzxU37OA&m=ZWAa2OqgTmi7qj2a3LdkCJBk2FgS_bjvOE25EF5aNqc&s=vWjyHE5BqIxOwmSLyN32eSCpw3RFfsm4oK1mfqwYLOI&e="><span class="s8"><span style="color:#0563C1"> Section
10.3.4</span></span></a>). A new value's specification document MUST<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> specify which properties make sense for that new kind of vCard<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> and which do not.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> Implementations MUST support the specific string values defined<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> above. <span class="s6"><b>If this property is absent, "individual" MUST be assumed</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b> as the default.</b></span> If this property is present but the<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> implementation does not understand its value (the value is an<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> x-name or iana-token that the implementation does not support),<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> the implementation SHOULD act in a neutral way, which usually<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> means treating the vCard as though its kind were "individual".<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> The presence of MEMBER properties MAY, however, be taken as an<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> indication that the unknown kind is an extension of "group".<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">ICANN could of course create and mandate a profile that describes how the jCard “kind” value can be used to distinguish between natural (“individual”) and legal (“org”) contacts. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">If we get pushback to re-using (or overloading) “individual” and “org” to indicate legal and natural, we could use the iana-token extension mechanism defined in the spec. Essentially this would allow us
to create two new RDAP specific “kind” values. E.g. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">"legal" <We would create a definition that would detail what the kind <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">value of “legal” means><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">"natural" <We would create a definition that would detail what the kind <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">value of “natural” means> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">This would be accomplished by creating an internet-id and submitting to IANA (IPT) for approval. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">Lastly, there is an internet-draft being worked on in the “regext” working group in the IETF. The regext working group is where all the RDAP technical specs are defined. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">This internet-draft, called the <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__tools.ietf.org_id_draft-2Dharrison-2Dregext-2Drdap-2Djcard-2Dprofile-2D00.html&d=DwMGaQ&c=OGmtg_3SI10Cogwk-ShFiw&r=qQNCXqU_XE2XIdXbawYmk-YDflYH6pd8ffXlzxU37OA&m=ZWAa2OqgTmi7qj2a3LdkCJBk2FgS_bjvOE25EF5aNqc&s=AH7s959LhuGeUQguI2S2cxYVbELvkhki8FKaCuYqBGo&e="><span class="s8"><span style="color:#0563C1">RDAP
jCard Profile Spec</span></span></a>, currently requires the use of kind in all RDAP jCard responses. <o:p></o:p></p>
<div style="margin-left:27.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s11">o </span>“Each jCard MUST contain a "kind" property. The value of that property MUST be "individual", "group", or "org".”<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">Now I don’t know the status of this draft - but it could be used as a “vehicle” to standardize any changes ICANN may need - assuming they were needed. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">RDAP Response snippets that use “kind = individual”<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__godaddy.com&d=DwMGaQ&c=OGmtg_3SI10Cogwk-ShFiw&r=qQNCXqU_XE2XIdXbawYmk-YDflYH6pd8ffXlzxU37OA&m=ZWAa2OqgTmi7qj2a3LdkCJBk2FgS_bjvOE25EF5aNqc&s=IpekxI99LmRE_mta6rPGepev0sTuawcVTFI9kuZfVVU&e="><span class="s8"><span style="color:#0563C1">godaddy.com</span></span></a> example
(registrar = GoDaddy)<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">"entities": [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> {<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "objectClassName": "entity",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "handle": "1",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "vcardArray": [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "vcard",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "version",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> {},<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "text",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "4.0"<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ],<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b> "kind",</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b> {},</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b> "text",</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b> "individual"</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ],<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "org",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> {<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "type": "work"<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> },<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "text",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "Go Daddy Operating Company, LLC"<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ],<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "adr",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> {},<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "text",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "Arizona",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "United States"<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ]<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ]<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ]<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ],<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "roles": [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "registrant"<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ],<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "events": [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> {<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "eventAction": "last update",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "eventDate": "2021-06-22T11:49:32Z"<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> }<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ],<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "remarks": [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> {<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "title": "REDACTED FOR PRIVACY",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "type": "object truncated due to authorization",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "description": [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "Some of the data in this object has been removed."<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ]<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> }<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ]<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> },<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__namecheap.com&d=DwMGaQ&c=OGmtg_3SI10Cogwk-ShFiw&r=qQNCXqU_XE2XIdXbawYmk-YDflYH6pd8ffXlzxU37OA&m=ZWAa2OqgTmi7qj2a3LdkCJBk2FgS_bjvOE25EF5aNqc&s=FSHWJZUJ53p9d6k9OgEGc8lhNOSZElpBgI8TCK2L_tM&e="><span class="s8"><span style="color:#0563C1">namecheap.com</span></span></a> example
(registrar = eNom)<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">"entities": [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> {<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "objectClassName": "entity",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "roles": [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "registrant"<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ],<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "vcardArray": [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "vcard",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "version",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> {},<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "text",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "4.0"<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ],<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <span class="s6"><b>"kind",</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b> {},</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b> "text",</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b> "individual"</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ],<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "lang",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> {},<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "language-tag",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "en"<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ],<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "adr",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> {},<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "text",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "AZ",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "US"<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ]<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ],<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "contact-uri",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> {},<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "uri",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "<a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__tieredaccess.com_contact_ccfaafca-2Db98c-2D4a8f-2D8746-2Dbdaa321c628d&d=DwMGaQ&c=OGmtg_3SI10Cogwk-ShFiw&r=qQNCXqU_XE2XIdXbawYmk-YDflYH6pd8ffXlzxU37OA&m=ZWAa2OqgTmi7qj2a3LdkCJBk2FgS_bjvOE25EF5aNqc&s=sODG-xyeBvBKzfJnJHIuAIblUNvbBZ9Nfrrc9bzL5lo&e="><span class="s8"><span style="color:#0563C1">https://tieredaccess.com/contact/ccfaafca-b98c-4a8f-8746-bdaa321c628d</span></span></a>"<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ]<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ]<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ],<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "remarks": [<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> {<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "title": "REDACTED FOR PRIVACY",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "description": "Some of the data in this object has been removed",<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> "type": "object redacted due to authorization"<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> }<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> ]<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> },<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b>RySG Response on Kind Data Element:</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s14" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="bumpedfont15"><b>RDAP “kind” element</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s15">• </span><span class="bumpedfont15">The “kind” element isn’t actually an RDAP element, it’s a vcard element (which is a different standard that has been incorporated into the RDAP specification).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s15">• </span><span class="bumpedfont15">The vcard “kind” element isn’t a great fit for differentiating between data of legal and natural persons registrations. The possible values of “group, “org”,
“individual” or “location” are not defined with GDPR or data protection in mind and leveraging them here would be a bit of a square peg/round hole. </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s15">• </span><span class="bumpedfont15">Each RDAP response contains multiple vcard elements (not just one for the entire domain lookup). In addition to a vcard for each domain contact, the registrar
specific data is returned as part of a vcard. The abuse contact email and abuse contact phone data are both also returned as separate vcards.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s15">• </span><span class="bumpedfont15">The vcard specification has not been a good fit for domain RDAP responses and there is an effort underway to replace vcard with a different standard (possibly
jcard).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="s7" style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span class="s6"><b>Steve Crocker from 17 Aug 2021 Zoom Chat:</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>01:23:43Steve Crocker, SSAC:If the kind data element is going to be expanded to include additional details of legal persons, the number of possibilities expands a bit. It’s manageable
but is a bit more than one might first think. The possible responses to the kind question become:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>01:23:51Steve Crocker, SSAC:Natural<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>01:24:12Steve Crocker, SSAC:Legal with personal data<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>01:24:19Steve Crocker, SSAC:Legal without personal data<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>01:24:36Steve Crocker, SSAC:Legal without specification as to whether it contains personal data<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>01:24:50Steve Crocker, SSAC:Unspecified<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>01:25:29Steve Crocker, SSAC:In addition to these five responses, there also has to be a way of indicating the lack of data, e.g. if the question hasn’t been asked.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>01:26:19Steve Crocker, SSAC:In practice, this might create a bit of confusion. For example, the registrant might have a hard time distinguishing whether to answer “natural” vs “legal
with personal”<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>01:27:57Steve Crocker, SSAC:An alternative approach is to use two distinct data elements, one for Natural/Legal/Unspecific and a separate one for Personal/NoPersonal/Unspecified. This
approach would also be confusing to some.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:-13.5pt"><span class="s3">• </span>01:27:59Steve Crocker, SSAC:I'M neutral as to which of these approaches is chosen. Both will work and both will be confusing to some. And either will be useful.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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