[Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] PP transfer issue

Kathy Kleiman kathy at kathykleiman.com
Tue Jan 26 15:08:25 UTC 2016


Tx Mary, but I am still missing the impact of the discussion below on 
our PPSAI recommendations. If I want to transfer my domain name(s) from 
Registrar A to Registrar B, both with Privacy and Proxy services, and to 
keep the data private as the transfer takes place (something we all 
agreed should happen) -- is there a problem, a limitation, a barrier? If 
so, how can we overcome it?

Best,
Kathy

On 11/25/2015 2:04 PM, Mary Wong wrote:
> Hello everyone,
>
> Just a quick note for those WG members who may not be familiar with 
> the IRTP, the changes to IRTP-C, or the implementation discussions – 
> it may help to note the following definition for the IRTP. I believe 
> that James is referring to the registrar’s discretion in determining 
> whether the purported change is or is not typographical in nature (see 
> in particular the words I’ve highlighted in bold and italics). This is 
> illustrated by the examples given:
>
> “Material Change” */means a non-typographical correction/*.  The 
> following will be considered material changes:
> (i)    A change to the Registered Name Holder’s name or organization 
> that does not appear to be a merely a typographical correction;
> (ii)    Any change to the Registered Name Holder’s name or 
> organization that is accompanied by a change of address or phone number;
> (iii)    Any change to the Registered Name Holder’s email address.
>
> The point about having discretion on this matter can be significant 
> because, under the Policy, a Material Change to a registrant’s name, 
> organizational address or email address _will_ be considered a Change 
> of Registrant and thus trigger the 60-day lock. Hence, 
> disabling/removal of a proxy service would trigger a lock – although 
> the current Policy contemplates another possible instance of registrar 
> discretion in such instances, i.e. a registrar has the discretion 
> (“may”) to permit the Registered Name Holder to opt out of the lock 
> _prior_ to the Change of Registrant request.
>
> I’m far from an expert on the IRTP, but hopefully the above helps to 
> explain the current proposed recommendation in the Final Report where, 
> in referring to IRTP-C, the WG is recommending that - in relation to 
> de-accreditation - /"where a Change of Registrant (as defined under 
> the IRTP) takes place during the process of de-accreditation of a 
> proxy service provider, a registrar should lift the mandatory 60-day 
> lock at the express request of the beneficial user, provided the 
> registrar has also been notified of the de–accreditation of the proxy 
> service provider”/.
>
> Thanks and cheers
> Mary
>
> Mary Wong
> Senior Policy Director
> Internet Corporation for Assigned Names & Numbers (ICANN)
> Telephone: +1 603 574 4889
> Email: mary.wong at icann.org
>
>
> From: <gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org 
> <mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org>> on behalf of "James M. 
> Bladel" <jbladel at godaddy.com <mailto:jbladel at godaddy.com>>
> Date: Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 11:24
> To: Mike Zupke <Mike.Zupke at icann.org <mailto:Mike.Zupke at icann.org>>, 
> "Metalitz, Steven" <met at msk.com <mailto:met at msk.com>>, Volker Greimann 
> <vgreimann at key-systems.net <mailto:vgreimann at key-systems.net>>, 
> "gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org <mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org>" 
> <gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org <mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org>>, 
> Amy Bivins <amy.bivins at icann.org <mailto:amy.bivins at icann.org>>
> Subject: Re: [Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] PP transfer issue
>
>     Hi folks.  Just responding to Mike’s post from last Wednesday:
>
>     The question of P/P services triggering the “Change of Registrant”
>     policy was not, IMO, sufficiently addressed by the IRTP WG.  It
>     was, however, the subject of extensive discussion by the
>     Implementation team, which ultimately determined that Registrar’s
>     should have the discretion to determine whether or not this
>     qualified as a Change of Registrant. For example, a Registrar may
>     determine that adding/removing an affiliated P/P service does NOT
>     trigger the change of registrant policy, but that an unaffiliated
>     P/P service contains too many unknowns, so explicit consent and a
>     60-day transfer lock may be warranted.
>
>     There are a number of practical scenarios where this flexibility
>     is needed, including dealing with transfers as part of an
>     aftermarket sale, implementation of a UDRP decision, billing or
>     payment failures for the P/P service, or termination due to a
>     violation of the P/P services terms.  I would also caution against
>     recommendations of any particular WG (PPSAI) explicitly reverse
>     recommendations or Implementation decisions of prior WGs (IRTP-C)
>     even before they have been adopted.
>
>     I don’t think this should materially affect the overall
>     recommendations of PPSAI, nor do I see any incompatibilities with
>     this and our recommendations.  But happy to discuss this point on
>     our next call.
>
>     Thanks—
>
>     J.
>
>
>     From: Mike Zupke <Mike.Zupke at icann.org <mailto:Mike.Zupke at icann.org>>
>     Date: Wednesday, November 18, 2015 at 7:10
>     To: "Metalitz, Steven" <met at msk.com <mailto:met at msk.com>>, Volker
>     Greimann <vgreimann at key-systems.net
>     <mailto:vgreimann at key-systems.net>>, James Bladel
>     <jbladel at godaddy.com <mailto:jbladel at godaddy.com>>, PPSAI WG
>     <gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org
>     <mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org>>, Amy Bivins
>     <amy.bivins at icann.org <mailto:amy.bivins at icann.org>>
>     Subject: RE: [Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] PP transfer issue
>
>     Sorry for the delayed reply.  We needed to consult with a few others.
>
>     In answer to Steve’s question (“Could you clarify whether the
>     60-day lock provision is part of the IRTP as a consensus policy,
>     or part of the implementation of that policy?”), the lock was
>     included in the policy recommendations of IRTP WG C, which were
>     adopted by the Council and Board.  There was no mention of privacy
>     or proxy services in that part of the recommendation.  So our
>     implementation of the IRTP C recommendations was done “to the
>     letter” of the recommendation, so to speak.  I.e., no exception
>     was made for privacy and proxy services.
>
>     We don’t believe the PPSAI working group is necessarily precluded
>     from addressing questions about how the to-be-created type of PP
>     registrations interact with the Transfer Policy just because the
>     Transfer Policy is an existing policy.  PPSAI charter question B-3
>     (here: https://community.icann.org/x/ihLRAg
>     <https://community.icann.org/x/ihLRAg>) spoke to having the WG
>     “[c]larify how transfers, renewals, and PEDNR policies should apply.”
>
>     With regard to the point James made, during implementation of the
>     IRTP C recommendations, we talked a good bit about how a proxy (or
>     the beneficial customer) could disable a proxy or privacy service
>     in a world where consent of the other party would now be required
>     in order to make the change in Whois.  The solution to that
>     question was to allow use of “designated agents” (see
>     https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/transfer-policy-2015-09-24-en#II
>     at 1.1.2) to approve Changes of Registrant.  I don’t believe the
>     matter of exempting PP registrations from the 60 day lock was
>     raised by the IRT or in public comment, although I do recall
>     occasionally that people would reference the work of this WG as
>     potentially being necessary to addressing interaction with
>     accredited PP service registrations and the Transfer Policy.
>
>     Hope that helps.
>
>     Mike Zupke
>
>     Director, Registrar Services
>
>     Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers
>
>     *From:* gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org
>     <mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org>
>     [mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org] *On Behalf Of *James
>     M. Bladel
>     *Sent:* Wednesday, November 18, 2015 6:12 AM
>     *To:* Volker Greimann <vgreimann at key-systems.net
>     <mailto:vgreimann at key-systems.net>>; gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org
>     <mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org>
>     *Subject:* Re: [Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] PP transfer issue
>
>     Agree, and I thought this was also the final determination of the
>     IRTP-C Implementation Review Team.  It came up several times…
>
>     Thanks-
>
>     J.
>
>     *From: *<gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org
>     <mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org>> on behalf of Volker
>     Greimann <vgreimann at key-systems.net
>     <mailto:vgreimann at key-systems.net>>
>     *Date: *Wednesday, November 18, 2015 at 4:22
>     *To: *PPSAI WG <gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org
>     <mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org>>
>     *Subject: *Re: [Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] PP transfer issue
>
>     In all honesty, a removal of an accredited privacy service should
>     not trigger the transfer lock as it does not imply an owner
>     change. I am therefore in favor of option 2)
>
>     Best,
>
>     Volker
>
>     Am 17.11.2015 um 19:01 schrieb Amy Bivins:
>
>         Dear PPSAI WG Members:
>
>         Here is the issue you asked staff to address by email today. 
>         This came to our attention after reflecting on the work done
>         Friday by the “implementation issues” sub-team.
>
>         In short, disabling a proxy or privacy service will trigger
>         the 60-day inter-registrar transfer lock required by IRTP C
>         (which takes effect on 1 August 2016,
>         https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/transfer-policy-2015-09-24-en
>         ). Although applicable generally, this issue is of particular
>         concern following de-accreditation of a privacy or proxy
>         service (if transfer to another registrar is required to
>         maintain privacy).
>
>         Here are 3 things the WG could consider doing to address this:
>
>         1. Maintain the status quo and leave the 60-day IRTP C lock in
>         place.
>         2. Create an exception for Privacy and Proxy Service
>         customers, so the 60 day IRTP C (inter-registrar transfer)
>         lock doesn't apply when/if the customer changes or removes the
>         PP service.
>         3. Create an exception for PP users only if a PP service is
>         de-accredited, so the IRTP C (inter-registrar transfer) lock
>         can be lifted by the beneficial user if the registrar has been
>         notified of de-accreditation.
>
>         Please let us know if you’d like to us to provide any further
>         background.
>
>         Thank you!
>
>         *Amy E. Bivins*
>
>         Registrar Policy Services Manager
>
>         *I*nternet *C*orporation for *A*ssigned *N*ames and *N*umbers
>         (ICANN)
>
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>
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