[gnso-rds-pdp-wg] Reputation systems are not just nice to have (was Re: What we want redux)

Fri Oct 20 22:06:17 UTC 2017

As I understand the legitimate interests prong, there is a balancing test that need to be performed to weigh the privacy interests of the individual registrant vs. the legitimate interests of the person/entity wanting to access use/that information.   Given that, I think it is incorrect to say point blank that individual registrant data that qualifies as personal information can’t be used for cybercrime investigation by non-law enforcement personnel.  I understand that protections may need to be implemented to address the balance, and I hope we can get to that discussion sooner rather than later.

From: gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org [mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org] On Behalf Of Stephanie Perrin
Sent: Thursday, October 19, 2017 12:15 PM
To: gnso-rds-pdp-wg at icann.org
Subject: Re: [gnso-rds-pdp-wg] Reputation systems are not just nice to have (was Re: What we want redux)

I apologize for being so late in catching up with all this email, but I did want to support what Maxim has said here, it is certainly my reading of the GDPR, the Directive on Policing, and what Buttarelli said in Copenhagen.  And to reiterate that those of us who say you cannot do something (eg. collect this data, display this data, retain this data) for the purposes of policing cybercrime are in no way dismissing the importance of policing cybercrime.

Stephanie

On 2017-10-04 10:06, Maxim Alzoba wrote:
Hello Chuck,

Reading the memo I came to the conclusion that all cyber investigating companies, which do not have accreditation of sorts of at least one EU country
are pure third parties and police exemptions from personal data legislation will not work for them.

(it was page 9)

Following this logic, they play no special role according to GDPR and thus I am not sure we can make it a primary purpose (or at least I am not sure it will be accepted by EU DPAs).

P.s: I do understand importance of anti-abuse cyber investigations, but not sure how to fit their special role into purposes, compliant with GDPR.
And which might be worse, local Law Enforcement do not fit either (if they are not from EU or there is no special treaty between EU and that country).

Sincerely Yours,

Maxim Alzoba
Special projects manager,
International Relations Department,
FAITID

m. +7 916 6761580(+whatsapp)
skype oldfrogger

Current UTC offset: +3.00 (.Moscow)

On Oct 4, 2017, at 16:08, Chuck <consult at cgomes.com<mailto:consult at cgomes.com>> wrote:

Note that the WG has already reached rough consensus that anti-abuse is a legitimate purpose for at least the minimum public data set.  (WG Agreement 11:  “Criminal Investigation & DNS Abuse Mitigation is a legitimate purpose for “Minimum Public Data Set” collection.”

Chuck

From: gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org<mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org> [mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org] On Behalf Of allison nixon
Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2017 2:57 PM
To: Jeremy Malcolm <jmalcolm at eff.org<mailto:jmalcolm at eff.org>>
Cc: gnso-rds-pdp-wg at icann.org<mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg at icann.org> >> gnso-rds-pdp-wg at icann.org<mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg at icann.org> <gnso-rds-pdp-wg at icann.org<mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg at icann.org>>
Subject: Re: [gnso-rds-pdp-wg] Reputation systems are not just nice to have (was Re: What we want redux)

Thank you for the clarification. I still disagree with it but it makes more sense.

I would like to highlight the ICANN webpage on WHOIS:

https://whois.icann.org/en/what-whois-data-used

What is WHOIS data used for?
WHOIS is indispensable to the smooth operation of the DNS and is used for many legitimate purposes, including:

     *   To contact network administrators for resolution of technical matters related to networks associated with a domain name (e.g., DNS or routing matter, origin and path analysis of DoS and other network-based attacks).
     *   To obtain the real world identity, business location and contact information of an online merchant or business, or generally, any organization that has an online presence.
     *   To establish or look into an identity in cyberspace, and as part of an incident response following an Internet or computer attack. (Security professionals and law enforcement agents use WHOIS to identify points of contact for a domain name.)
     *   To gather investigative leads (i.e., to identify parties from whom additional information might be obtained). Law enforcement agents use WHOIS to find email addresses and attempt to identify the location of an alleged perpetrator of a crime involving fraud.
     *   To investigate spam, law enforcement agents look to the WHOIS database to collect information on the website advertised in the spam.
Those and others are currently listed on ICANN's website as uses for WHOIS data. To reject anti-abuse as a purpose would be to shift away from the currently accepted purposes of WHOIS.

On Tue, Oct 3, 2017 at 5:41 PM, Jeremy Malcolm <jmalcolm at eff.org<mailto:jmalcolm at eff.org>> wrote:
On 3/10/17 2:31 pm, John Bambenek via gnso-rds-pdp-wg wrote:
>
> To confirm and clarify your meaning... you don't think there should be
> a WHOIS/RDS and the only means to contact a domain owner should be on
> their website. Is that correct?
>

No, we are fine with registrants making some information available
through WHOIS/RDS subject to data protection law (eg. informed consent,
etc).  But we don't think that a starting point for the design of the
RDS has to take the requirements of anti-abuse specialists or reputation
systems as an essential element.

--
Jeremy Malcolm
Senior Global Policy Analyst
Electronic Frontier Foundation
https://eff.org<https://eff.org/>
jmalcolm at eff.org<mailto:jmalcolm at eff.org>

Tel: 415.436.9333 ext 161<tel:415.436.9333%20ext%20161>

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