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<body lang="EN-US" link="#0563C1" vlink="#954F72" style="word-wrap:break-word">
<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Dear TPR WG Members,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Please find below the notes and action items from today’s call.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">The next TPR WG meeting will be</span> on<span style="color:black">
<b>Tuesday,</b></span><b> 15 February 2022 <span style="color:black">at </span>16:00<span style="color:black"> UTC</span></b><span style="color:black">.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"><br>
Best regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Emily, Julie, Berry, and Caitlin </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><u><span style="color:black"><o:p><span style="text-decoration:none"> </span></o:p></span></u></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><u><span style="color:black">Action Items</span>:<o:p></o:p></u></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b>ACTION ITEM: Staff to update the document at </b><a href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/docs.google.com/document/d/1RGow_TYPSESvI9DFweF3T_g7vgufg6zCwEdSsUjBfqs/edit__;!!PtGJab4!sQkbkEXuWsv1j2i8mdAbJ0-FrsfcejL9juXDiE61fkUs6GVMlkmVGwlfycuE81PRbvz7SC32Hw$" title="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/docs.google.com/document/d/1RGow_TYPSESvI9DFweF3T_g7vgufg6zCwEdSsUjBfqs/edit__;!!PtGJab4!sQkbkEXuWsv1j2i8mdAbJ0-FrsfcejL9juXDiE61fkUs6GVMlkmVGwlfycuE81PRbvz7SC32Hw$">Working
document [docs.google.com]</a><b>with the suggestion from today’s discussion for a mandatory 10-calendar-day lock for domain creation and transfer for continued WG consideration. WG members are encouraged to review and to add comments and rationale in the
document.<o:p></o:p></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><o:p> </o:p></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="color:black">Transfer Policy Review Phase 1 - Meeting #</span>35</b><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:18.0pt"><b><span style="color:black">Tuesday </span>08 February<span style="color:black"> 202</span>2<span style="color:black"> at
</span>16:00<span style="color:black"> UTC<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">1. Roll Call & SOI updates (5 minutes)<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">2. Welcome & Chair updates (5 minutes)<o:p></o:p></p>
<ul type="disc">
<li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">No updates provided.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Still waiting for input from the Registry Stakeholder Group.<o:p></o:p></span></li></ul>
<p class="MsoNormal">3. Continue discussion of registrar-applied locks upon domain creation and domain transfer (60 minutes) --
<a href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/docs.google.com/document/d/1RGow_TYPSESvI9DFweF3T_g7vgufg6zCwEdSsUjBfqs/edit__;!!PtGJab4!sQkbkEXuWsv1j2i8mdAbJ0-FrsfcejL9juXDiE61fkUs6GVMlkmVGwlfycuE81PRbvz7SC32Hw$" title="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/docs.google.com/document/d/1RGow_TYPSESvI9DFweF3T_g7vgufg6zCwEdSsUjBfqs/edit__;!!PtGJab4!sQkbkEXuWsv1j2i8mdAbJ0-FrsfcejL9juXDiE61fkUs6GVMlkmVGwlfycuE81PRbvz7SC32Hw$">
Working document [docs.google.com]</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Post-Creation Lock:<o:p></o:p></p>
<ul type="disc">
<li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Need to come to agreement on what the timeline should be – has to be at least 5 days, if not as long as 60 days.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Try to have consistency with creation locks and transfer locks.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">10-day minimum for both could be about right. 5 days could be too short.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Should consider using weeks or hours to be more precise.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">In terms of 10 days: what is it about 10 days that allows us to avoid the charge-back issue?<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">10 days is enough to allow for the various processes based on analysis – time to identify the fraud and take it down.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Paypal disputes are not solved instant, 10 days seems reasonable.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">It can differ from country to country.
<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">We are going to have to provide the rationale for the Initial Report in public comment.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">What's the point of having a lock at all? Which opportunity does it offer to the Registrar over the registrant?<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Also what is the scope of fraud attempts? Is it so much that it justifies a longer lock period, or is it relatively minor?<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">See:
<a href="https://docs.adyen.com/risk-management/understanding-disputes/dispute-process-and-flow#defense-timeframes">
https://docs.adyen.com/risk-management/understanding-disputes/dispute-process-and-flow#defense-timeframes</a>.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">No, not only payment issues -- Also domain thefts and a needed time for investigations.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">And we are discussing a digital service which can transfer and cannot be compared to buying a TV.
<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Registrars will argue that 5 days isn’t viable; 7 days also is too short.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Generally the credit card companies are pretty quick to resolve fraud now, but that could change.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">We need to factor in the registrars and charge back, and the ease of being a registrant – user experience. Would like to have the number
of days as low as possible. There are lots of numbers available on line about charge-back.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">What is the reason behind the lock?
<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">In our rationale we can discuss a fraud-deterrence element.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Standardizing this would help a lot of registries and registrars.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Let’s focus on the minimum number and the rationale for it.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Going from 60 days down to 10 feels like a Big Change, but the reasoning behind the 10 day period does make sense.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Would be easier for the registrant if those lock periods (post-reg and post-xfer) are the same.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">We have two types of locks – post-creation and post-transfer. Those locks need to be different for different reasons.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Argue against a range of minimum and maximum – hard to explain to the registrant.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">The after transfer is more prone to theft. Not a huge factor on creation, but still happens.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Thought we would have a number for all registrars and registries, with no ranges.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Focus on whether we have an upper limit or whether we just have a minimum.
<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Group seems to agree that 5 is too short with support for 10 days.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Could be a mandatory 10-day lock with an optional up to X-day lock.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">If one of the primary reasons for post-creation lock is to protect registrars from fraud, what about a registrar who isn’t concerned
about fraud – could they lower or waive the lock period?<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">If there is going to be a minimum 10-day lock it would be disappointing if registrars picked a hodge-podge of days above that minimum.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">If we went to 30 days that would allow more flexibility.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Discretion defeats the purpose of the policy. Needs to be the same for everyone.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">If we allow any range a lot of registrars will just keep it at 60.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Registrars could still decide whether to have a lock.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">If we are going to have a lock we shouldn’t have a minimum, just a mandatory number of days.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Have we heard reasons to allow flexibility in the lock period?<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Can you transfer the day after without impacting the grace periods? The grace periods will be a problem.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Grace Period is a well-defined term. It's not a "arbitrary lock time".<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Are we setting an “up-to” date?<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">There should be a mandatory number – no maximum or minimum.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Could have both a strict number and a max number.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">There is a minimum grace period. We have to respect that.
<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">If you set a maximum then you have to set a minimum. If you pick one number you don’t have that problem.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Could have 10-day minimum and a 30-day maximum.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Don’t see an argument for 30 days.
<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Seems like agreement for a mandatory 10-day lock with a rationale for create and transfer.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Make it clear that we are talking about calendar 10 days, not business days, or hours.<o:p></o:p></span></li></ul>
<p class="MsoNormal">Post-Transfer Lock:<o:p></o:p></p>
<ul type="disc">
<li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Increased probability of fraud with transfers to a 60-day lock is appropriate.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Statistics don’t show the high numbers of domain name theft.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Support for 10-day lock.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">With the creation lock hard to envision the creation and then wanting to transfer right away. One example is that many domain names
are purchased on the secondary market and the purchaser in the marketplace will want to move it to their own registrar – lock would prevent that from happening. No reason to save the registrant from themselves if there are two willing parties, so removing
the mandatory requirement may be appropriate.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Post creation and post transfer are quite different. In a post transfer if the name is lost the company could be at risk.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">At lot of theft occurs most likely because the thief has control of something.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Think it is a big question as to whether this is common.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">10 days seems to be sufficient for both creation and transfer and would be less confusing for a registrant.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">The post-transfer lock is exactly the time, you have to rewind the fraudulent transfer. 10 days is far too low to even notice or contact
the reseller (chain). Especially if the FOA to the registrant is dropped.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Concerned that we are making this more strict (there current is no mandatory lock policy) without justification.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Wondering what the
<i>industry</i> advantage is of this post lock (creation or transfer)? Heard about fraud and stolen names, but why wouldn’t a registrar put a no-transfer allowed lock as soon as it comes in? Whatever process you use for the TAC could include fraud protections/locks.
If you don’t want to lock then that’s your choice. Registrars can already control this.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">One reason is lack of consistency among registrars.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">If feels like we are solving a problem of bad actors, not good actors. So what is the industry advantage.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From prior policy development around transfer we have experienced a 60-day lock for change of registrant (to be discussed later). We
are talking about a mandatory lock of some duration with a release valve to be somewhat involved to achieve. Having a lock is to mitigate registrar bounces and to have consistency. There’s mentions of the aftermarket, and that is significant and relevant,
but consensus policy doesn’t apply to all participants in the aftermarketplace. The consensus policies apply to the contracted parties.<o:p></o:p></span></li></ul>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b>ACTION ITEM: Staff to update the document at </b><a href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/docs.google.com/document/d/1RGow_TYPSESvI9DFweF3T_g7vgufg6zCwEdSsUjBfqs/edit__;!!PtGJab4!sQkbkEXuWsv1j2i8mdAbJ0-FrsfcejL9juXDiE61fkUs6GVMlkmVGwlfycuE81PRbvz7SC32Hw$" title="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/docs.google.com/document/d/1RGow_TYPSESvI9DFweF3T_g7vgufg6zCwEdSsUjBfqs/edit__;!!PtGJab4!sQkbkEXuWsv1j2i8mdAbJ0-FrsfcejL9juXDiE61fkUs6GVMlkmVGwlfycuE81PRbvz7SC32Hw$">Working
document [docs.google.com]</a><b>with the suggestion from today’s discussion for a mandatory 10-calendar-day lock for domain creation and transfer for continued WG consideration. WG members are encouraged to review and to add comments and rationale in the
document.<o:p></o:p></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">4. Begin discussion on NACKing (15 minutes – time permitting) --
<a href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/docs.google.com/document/d/1L2bZnhJUY3VxyAjVCrkyVqdttOPn2EaqBARRRnEPd0Q/edit__;!!PtGJab4!sQkbkEXuWsv1j2i8mdAbJ0-FrsfcejL9juXDiE61fkUs6GVMlkmVGwlfycuE81PRbvx3xnJXDg$" title="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/docs.google.com/document/d/1L2bZnhJUY3VxyAjVCrkyVqdttOPn2EaqBARRRnEPd0Q/edit__;!!PtGJab4!sQkbkEXuWsv1j2i8mdAbJ0-FrsfcejL9juXDiE61fkUs6GVMlkmVGwlfycuE81PRbvx3xnJXDg$">
Working document [docs.google.com]</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<ul type="disc">
<li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Pick this up at the next meeting.<o:p></o:p></span></li></ul>
<p class="MsoNormal">5. AOB (5 minutes) <o:p></o:p></p>
<ul type="disc">
<li class="MsoListParagraph" style="mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Next call: Tuesday 15 February 2022 at 16:00 UTC</span><o:p></o:p></li></ul>
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