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<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Dear TPR WG members,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Please find below the brief notes and action items from today’s meeting. <b><i><o:p></o:p></i></b></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><i><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">The next meeting will be on Tuesday, 01 August at 1600 UTC.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Best regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div style="border:none;border-bottom:double windowtext 2.25pt;padding:0in 0in 1.0pt 0in">
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Emily, Julie, Berry, and Caitlin<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">ACTION ITEMS/HOMEWORK:
<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Re: Charter Question i1 ICANN-Approved Transfer (Bulk Transfers) -- Staff will create a working document in Google for WG members to provide comments/suggestions.<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Re: 1.B proposed updates: Staff will create a working document in Google for WG members to provide comments/suggestions.<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> <b> </b><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Transfer Policy Review - Meeting #97</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Proposed Agenda</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">25 July 2023</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">1. Welcome and Chair updates<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<ul style="margin-top:0in" type="disc">
<li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Reminder that we do plan on continuing our work through August.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Steve Crocker, SSAC: Issue of smooth transfer of signed zones, raised but it was out of scope. SSAC is working on DS automation and glitch-free
transfer – will send the wording to you and will brief groups when the report comes out.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Jothan: We shall always make best efforts on transfer of DNSSEC related _stuff_, but we frequently find this rather challenging when 3rd
party DNS Providers are used.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Steinar: ALAC INPUT ON TRANSFER POLICY PDP CHARTER RECOMMENDATIONS PHASE 2 G3 will be distributed to the GNSO-TPR mailing list later this
week. Apologies for being delayed a few days.<o:p></o:p></span></li></ul>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">2. Discussion of Charter Question i1 ICANN-Approved Transfer (Bulk Transfers): See attached slides, starting with slide 17.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">i1) In light of these challenges described in section 3.1.7.2 of the <a href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/gnso.icann.org/sites/default/files/file/field-file-attach/final-issue-report-pdp-transfer-policy-review-12jan21-en.pdf__;!!PtGJab4!8BMgLwLdfW2a6aXuHZWRcix11UiTY18y1746pWqqmes4jMuGnXfF0rAviy5byWJFLxlMDhUInfFinYC6QlhIe8punTd8h9QoQ9ha$" title="https://gnso.icann.org/sites/default/files/file/field-file-attach/final-issue-report-pdp-transfer-policy-review-12jan21-en.pdf">Final
Issue Report [gnso.icann.org]</a>, should the required fee in Section I.B.2 of the <a href="https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/transfer-policy-2016-06-01-en" title="https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/transfer-policy-2016-06-01-en">Transfer Policy</a> be
revisited or removed in certain circumstances?<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<ol style="margin-top:0in" start="1" type="a">
<li class="MsoPlainText" style="margin-left:12.75pt;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo5"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Recap of overarching themes from last call<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<ul style="margin-top:0in" type="disc">
<li class="MsoPlainText" style="margin-left:.25in;mso-list:l4 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">The WG seemed to agree that in the event of an involuntary termination involving a bulk transfer, the mandatory bulk transfer
fee should be waived. <o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="margin-left:.25in;mso-list:l4 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Further discussion needed on future of mandatory bulk transfer fee<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="margin-left:.25in;mso-list:l4 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Language in Section I.B needs rethinking<o:p></o:p></span></li></ul>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Discussion:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<ul style="margin-top:0in" type="disc">
<li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Any discussion of gaming? That you could break them up into tranches of fewer than 50K to avoid a fee? Probably wouldn’t apply for portfolio
transfers --- but will come up in other discussions.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Could also be voluntary registrar transfers. We need to be clear there.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Do we need clarity on what we mean by “bulk transfer”? We could think about whether there is better/more clear term?<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Curious – it is the registry that loses $50K; are they willing to take these on? For involuntary is happens really infrequently.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">In terms of the number of involuntary transfers over the last 5 years there were only two of them, but they do happen. The $50K fee is
also for voluntary transfers as between registrars. In a voluntary setting, should there still be a $50K fee. See questions below.<o:p></o:p></span></li></ul>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">ACTION ITEM: Re: Charter Question i1 ICANN-Approved Transfer (Bulk Transfers) -- Staff will create a working document in Google for WG members to provide comments/suggestions.<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p>
<ol style="margin-top:0in" start="2" type="a">
<li class="MsoPlainText" style="margin-left:12.75pt;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo5"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Potential options for mandatory fee<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<ul style="margin-top:0in" type="disc">
<li class="MsoPlainText" style="margin-left:.25in;mso-list:l4 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Should the mandatory fee be removed from the policy and left between Ry/Rr?<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="margin-left:.25in;mso-list:l4 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Should the mandatory fee be tiered based on volume rather than one lump sum?<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="margin-left:.25in;mso-list:l4 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Should the mandatory fee language remain as is? <o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="margin-left:.25in;mso-list:l4 level1 lfo6"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Other options?<o:p></o:p></span></li></ul>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Discussion:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<ul style="margin-top:0in" type="disc">
<li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Not in favor of Rr/Ry agreements.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Comment: Agree with the notion that the fee was added to mitigate overuse seems odd. Looking at this as an overarching principle – why
not come at this from the point of view there’s work for everyone involved, so if there’s a fee who should pay? Could be paid by whoever is motivating it? Separately, we could consider what that fee would look like.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">When we talk about cost-recovery then the registrar would cover it as a flat fee. But registrar may also incur costs.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Two scenarios – voluntary and involuntary. Involuntary is good for the ecosystem. Who initiates an involuntary transfer? If it’s initiated
by someone going out of business you won’t get a payment from that entity. Whatever scenario, registries and registrars will incur costs.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Maybe it isn’t fair for ICANN to pay if it is a problem that ICANN has discovered (involuntary scenario).<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Even in an involuntary scenario you charge the registrar going out of business but you might not get anything.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Maybe the involuntary scenario is an exception.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Voluntary scenario: probably makes sense to include a fee paid by the registrar – flat fee, cost recovery? What does this language look
like and how specific it should be.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Tiered approach: we don’t even know if that is even reasonable for a registry. Should be an option to bring a complaint about fees to ICANN
Compliance.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">By volume there is economy of scale – 10K isn’t 10 times the effort compared to 1K.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Cost recovery has concerns because registrars don’t know what to expect – whose checking this and how do you know it’s a reasonable fee?<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Cost recovery policies are inherently troublesome. The U.S. government has imposed cost recovery policies on the operation of university
computer centers. The results are terrible. The party asking for cost recovery has to justify the costs, which leads to both a lot of gaming and a lot of intrusive auditing.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">This should be up front. It should be a process that the registry has figured out and knows what the cost is.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Should the policy say that registries should publish their fees? Why not?<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">So registries include in their RRAs for domain names – include bulk transfer fees? But how is this enforced? Do you have to tell ICANN
your fee? <o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">There needs to be a check and balance somewhere.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Starting to see some registries not putting fees in their RRAs, instead in web portals. Urge to have one fee structure across all gTLDs.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Registries and registrar will have different cost models.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Wonder if we can come up with a model, but that doesn’t have specific numbers?<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Does the bulk transfer fee have to be mandatory – maybe build in exceptions?<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Multiple TLDS – could be good if the transfer could be by organization on the registry services side. Also there are registrar families
– could the fee be for the transfer process rather than by name/TLD?<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Should the fee be left to the registry/registrar. Or could set a maximum.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">It needs to be accountable. ICANN Compliance should be able to enforce.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Think we are focusing too much on a single registry operator. How this plays out across a number of TLDs.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Seems like we still want to be able to have flexibility in the fee assessment/amount and control an upper bound.<o:p></o:p></span></li></ul>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<ol style="margin-top:0in" start="3" type="a">
<li class="MsoPlainText" style="margin-left:12.75pt;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo5"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">1.B proposed updates – see suggested language in brackets in slide 23.<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Discussion:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<ul style="margin-top:0in" type="disc">
<li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">The way that 1.B is currently worded is confusing.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">On slide 22 – should be a 5<sup>th</sup> bubble/bucket were the bulk is performed under standard EPP circumstances.
<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Currently the above scenario is not prohibited but might want to put parameters around it.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoPlainText" style="mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Not sure what you would achieve by including it in the policy.<o:p></o:p></span></li></ul>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">ACTION ITEM: Re: 1.B proposed updates: Staff will create a working document in Google for WG members to provide comments/suggestions.<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">3. AOB<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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