[tz] zone.tab comments Canada - places -> locations

[Tobias Conradi]

On Thu, May 10, 2012 at 2:21 PM, John Haxby <john.haxby at oracle.com> wrote:
> On 10/05/12 05:06, Tobias Conradi wrote:
>> Current:
>> tzdata2012c/zone.tab
>> America/Halifax       Atlantic Time - Nova Scotia (most places), PEI
>> America/Glace_Bay     Atlantic Time - Nova Scotia - places that did not
>> observe DST 1966-1971
>> America/Nipigon       Eastern Time - Ontario & Quebec - places that did not
>> observe DST 1967-1973
>>
>> Proposed:
>> America/Halifax       Atlantic Time - Nova Scotia (most locations), PEI
>> America/Glace_Bay     Atlantic Time - Nova Scotia - locations that did not
>> observe DST 1966-1971
>> America/Nipigon       Eastern Time - Ontario & Quebec - locations that did
>> not observe DST 1967-1973
>>
>> Reason:
>> Harmonize.
>>
>> Theory uses "locations" (9x) more often than "places" (2x)
>>
>> zone.tab uses "place" only thrice, namely within the comments field of
>> the three above zone for Canada.
>>
>> zone.tab uses "location" more than 20x.
>
> No.
No what?

>   A native English speaker (like me) would not swap "place" for
> "location" here unless you meant specific points within those regions.
A)
It is undefined in your sentence what you mean by "specific point", so
I cannot tell whether I meant that.

Maybe you who claims to be a native English speaker can explain the
difference between
a) "location" as in
"Central Standard Time - Saskatchewan - most locations"
and
b) "place" as in
"Atlantic Time - Nova Scotia (most places), PEI"
to those readers on the mailing list that don't see one, but would
like to do so in case there is one?

B)
1) Concise Oxford English Dictionary
© 2008 Oxford University Press
http://www.wordreference.com/definition/location
a particular place or position

http://www.wordreference.com/definition/place
a particular position or point in space; a location

2)
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/location
- a place of settlement, activity, or residence
- a place or situation occupied
- a tract of land of designated situation or limits
- Can be confused:  local, locale, locality, location .

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/place
Synonyms 1.  location, locale, locality, site.

3)
"locations" in my proposal was meant as plural.

C)
I mean and meant location as in zone.tab
"Central Standard Time - Saskatchewan - most locations"

D)
I mean and meant location as in Theory file:
1) labels the region with a notable location
2) Clock transitions ... are recorded for each such location
3) Names normally have the form AREA/LOCATION, where AREA is the name
of a continent or ocean, and LOCATION is the name of a specific
location within that region.
4) general rules used for choosing location names
5) Include at least one location per time zone rule set
6) One such location is enough.
7) don't bother to include more than one location
8) Keep locations compact.  Use cities or small islands,...  locations
into different time zones.
9) Use the most populous among locations in a country's time zone
maybe 10) The file `zone.tab' lists the geographical locations
11) Use UTC ... for locations while uninhabited.

> You might say "locales" instead of "places"
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/locale
a place or locality, especially with reference to events or
circumstances connected with it.

I think, if "places" is unambiguous and precise, Tobias Conradi, a
non-native English speaker, wouldn't say "locales" instead of "places"
in technical documentation when referring to places/locations on the
planet earth.

> but that would be odd as
> that meaning of locale is confusing
> if you're anywhere near anything to
> do with computers.
Indeed.

> One could argue that there is a case for
> simplifying sentences and language,
Agreed.

>but that would generally avoid choosing
> shorter, simpler words (place) over longer ones (location).
Disagreeing. Me, a non-native English speaker, I would contest that
simplifying sentences and language would generally avoid shorter words
(place) over longer ones (location).

But me - a non-native English speaker - I would try to avoid choosing
different words for same meanings in a technical specification or
documentation. I would try to be consistent and to use same words for
same meanings. I would also try to define words. For the tzdb project
I would try to define "location" in the Theory file.

/Everything else - beside word length - being equal/ I would support
replacing longer words with shorter words.

-- 
Tobias Conradi
Rheinsberger Str. 18
10115 Berlin
Germany

http://tobiasconradi.com/