[tz] tm_isdst: to be or not to be?

Steffen Nurpmeso steffen at sdaoden.eu
Mon Nov 20 21:32:25 UTC 2023

Peter Krefting via tz wrote in
 <4e590c51-10ed-6aec-f82d-ef01b72ab704 at softwolves.pp.se>:
 |Steffen Nurpmeso via tz:
 |> In sofar "daylight saving" is a human engineering trick that is
 |> cheap but nice to have.  Whoever did it is worth a worthy Noble
 |> price.  (Thus not in these times, but maybe later again.)
 |The problem with changing clocks and living up north is that it is 
 |completely useless. In summer, I don't care if we get twilight between 
 |02 and 04 or between 01 and 03, nights are still light. And in winter 
 |I don't really care if it is dark from 14:30 or 15:30, days are still 
 |dark. The only time it actually makes a difference is around the equinox.

I would do it differently myself, for Germany, to have more light
in the afternoon.  (That is, if it would be me, "regular work
hours" would not start before 9 or 10 o'clock, Saturday would not
be a regular work day again, Sunday not at all, and i think in
Sweden at least in parts four-day-work-weeks were at some time
regular?, in Austria they disappear again where they existed.  In
any way, then this had to be rethought.  Maybe different work
times in winter?  Schools in particular.)

 |Russia abolished clock changing, citing the medical issues:
 |"President Dimitry Medvedev had made the decision to forgo daylight 
 |savings earlier this year, citing a report the Russian Academy of 
 |Medical Sciences. The report found that when the clocks are changed, 
 |the number of heart attacks increases by 1.5 times and the rate of 
 |suicides grows by 66 per cent."

Russia is a very large country, from the desert to the arctic, not
to talk about the west-east distance.  Of course population is not
spread evenly, but nonetheless.  And i personally am careful with
anything that happened in between, say, 1990-2 to maybe 2007-10.
They are still spending a lot of money to update run down houses
and flats in large style, especially necessary still in the far
east (what i think).  But 'happy they can.  (I myself of course am
all in favour of wood, clay, and other such things, rather than
concrete, but even in the rich west i am pretty lonely with that.)
Not bad for a country that likely plunders itself rather than
others!  Whatever.

You know, i cannot help it.  I have not read the article you
quote.  Too different are the living conditions from eg Moscow, or
a small village on the countryside, let alone some distant
sibirian one.  Or from an aerospace engineer to a bread factory
worker to an alcoholic living in a communal appartment with shared
kitchen and toilet, to a mother with four children of different
age living in the same appartment.  Interesting what they now do
with Norilsk which Wikipedia claims to be the most dirty city in
the world and such.  On the country side, people there are still
who need to consider in winter whether they go for fetching water
into the cold, or stay in the kitchen with its wood-driven oven.
This is a decision which takes time when you are an old woman.
Look at her (it is an old photo, granted)


So may she finally discovered the heaven they all talk about.  It
was a hart live, and who knows how many then said to themselves
that it is not worth the hazzle to go.

I know many animals fly to the south, hectically try to eat as
much as they can, .. give up .., _or_ die, in the fall.
So you are saying, if i understood that correctly, that the
additional impetus of a clock change increases that normal
seasonal ... whatever it is?

Well.  That can be true.
But then again live goes on.  Humanity knows for many decades what
will happen in this system, but nonetheless, the SUVs are getting
bigger, the holidays are getting more expensive, the luxury of the
western world is *IT* (for example the Fin who now heads
Mercedes-Benz drops the small classes in 2025 even though they get
sold like grazy, because luxury it is).  We in fact started just
another race with those dirty electrical cars, instead of spending
a bit and waiting three or four more years, and then using those
fuell cell cars that they talked about already in the 80s.
No no, this is apples and oranges.
Consciously we kill millions over millions, cause millions and
millions of illnesses for smartphone production aka its resources
all over the planet, and cause terrible living conditions, now or
in a few years from now, with hundreds of millions loosing their
home forever as the oceans rise.
Let me please mention this bigotry.

So in the end: i want to take into account the Russian condition
by that time (it was getting better, luckily), and those many
millions with an alcohol problem (and the alcohol quality, at
times).  So, in my opinion, any political decision that increases
"light" -- again i want to recall that by the end of the 90s
Russia could not even pay quite some pensions, and that many
people luckily still had their datcha where they could grow food,
too!, even in the early 00s many western companies plundering as
they could (and they can)!, a lot of distortion there were!,
i have just recently reread wonderful Peter Scholl-Latour's
"Rußland im Zangengriff" ("cramped russia") from 2007, mind you!,
heh!!, worth translating the Ukranian section alone!!!, HAH!!.

It is not that i account only will to value people.
I mean Princess Leia died while approaching Los Angeles airport
of Trump-voted Unites States of America.  With a heart attack!
At that age!  And her mother a day later.
Now what are you going to do?
Forbid Trump?

(P.S.: the wonderful german singer Herbert Grönemeyer sang over 40
years ago "Amerika, prügel dich wenn du dich prügeln musst in
deinem eigenen Land".  Top modern.  I think Trump knows this song.
Bring the boys back home.  So to say.)

 |I also remember reading a report that the dark mornings you get from 
 |setting the clock forward causes higher rates of depression. And that 
 |is the one thing I *do* care about with clocks in winter: I find it a 
 |lot easier to wake up in the morning when we get daylight at 8:30 
 |compared to if we would get it at 9:30.

I totally agree with you!
(Though get into bed at around 5am in the morning, but i hate
standing up and it is getting dark again already.)

 |(My brother-in-law in Tromsø of course does not have this problem at 
 |all, the sun sets there next week, and will not rise again until 

Brave northern people.
Mind you, i never ever have seen those northern lights in the sky.
Luckily i am an idiot and do not know what it is.
(Which reminds me of a maybe famous american quote, "they got
twice --- all the sun!!!", whoever said that.)

 |\\// Peter - http://www.softwolves.pp.se/

I do not know whether that svedish virgin agrees with this
classification.  And Saab now also only remains as a weapon.  :-(

 --End of <4e590c51-10ed-6aec-f82d-ef01b72ab704 at softwolves.pp.se>

|Der Kragenbaer,                The moon bear,
|der holt sich munter           he cheerfully and one by one
|einen nach dem anderen runter  wa.ks himself off
|(By Robert Gernhardt)

More information about the tz mailing list