[Ctn-crosscom] Updated Attendance MP3 CTN meeting - Monday 20 April 2015

Heather Forrest Heather.Forrest at acu.edu.au
Fri Apr 24 07:39:07 UTC 2015 

Dear CWG colleagues,


Please find attached an updated working version of the CTN-UCTN Options Paper that attempts to incorporate the comments made in our call as transcribed in the links noted below. Please feel free to add and circulate your comments/amendments prior to our next meeting to be scheduled for roughly 10 days from now.


I have not deleted any existing comments but amendments have been made to deal with the questions they raise. If comments are adequately addressed, they can be noted for deletion during our next discussion.


Many thanks and best wishes to all,


Heather





________________________________
From: ctn-crosscom-bounces at icann.org <ctn-crosscom-bounces at icann.org> on behalf of Nathalie Peregrine <nathalie.peregrine at icann.org>
Sent: Monday, April 20, 2015 18:35
To: ctn-crosscom at icann.org
Cc: gnso-secs at icann.org
Subject: [Ctn-crosscom] Updated Attendance MP3 CTN meeting - Monday 20 April 2015

Dear All,

 Please find the MP3 recording for the Cross-Community Working Group on Use of Country/Territory Names as TLDs meeting held on Monday 20 April 2015 at 06:00 UTC at: http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-ccwg-unct-20apr15-en.mp3
On page:
<http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#nov><http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#jan><http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#mar>http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#<http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#apr>apr<http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#apr>
The recordings and transcriptions of the calls are posted on the GNSO Master Calendar page:
http://gnso.icann.org/calendar/
Attendees:
ccNSO
Ron Sherwood, .vi
Annebeth Lange, .no
Laura Hutchison, .uk
Joke Braeken, .eu
Mirjana Tasic, .rs

GNSO
Heather Forrest, IPC (Co-Chair)
Carlos Raul Guttierez, NPOC
Maxim Alzoba, NTAG

At-Large
Cheryl Langdon-Orr

ISO
Jaap Akkerhuis

Apologies:
Susan Payne, IPC

ICANN staff:
Bart Boswinkel
Lars Hoffman
Nathalie Peregrine

** Please let me know if your name has been left off the list **
Mailing list archives:http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ctn-crosscom/
 Wiki page:https://community.icann.org/x/X7XhAg

Thank you.
Kind regards,
Nathalie
Adobe Connect chat transcript for Monday 20 April 2015:
Nathalie  Peregrine:Dear all, welcome to the CCWG on Use of Country/ Territory Names as TLDs on the 20 April 2015
  Lars Hoffmann:Good morning all.
  Ron Sherwood:Good (very early) morning everyone
  Heather Forrest:Hello Ron and Joke, thank you for joining us.
  Heather Forrest:Sorry for the early hour, Ron - apparently there are big goings on in Costa Rica today involving Fadi and we tried to steer clear of overlapping with those activities
  Ron Sherwood:I do understand...  zzzzzz!
  Heather Forrest:Welcome, Bart!
  Bart Boswinkel:Helloe everyone
  Heather Forrest:Thank you all for your timeliness - we'll wait 1 or 2 minutes to start to have another co-chair on the call
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):Hello Everybody
  Heather Forrest:Welcome, Maxim - thank you for joining the call today
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):Do we have adobe audio?
  Heather Forrest:I believe so but will let Nathalie confirm
  Nathalie  Peregrine:Yes Maxim
  Nathalie  Peregrine:I see you have activated your mic
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):audio test positive
  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:Hi all
  Bart Boswinkel:I am the call, but there is a lot of echo
  Bart Boswinkel:Both you an dLars
  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:no echo for me via AC  atm
  Bart Boswinkel:resolved
  Ron Sherwood:No echo here on AC
  Carlos Raul:sorry
  Carlos Raul:here I Am
  Heather Forrest:great, carlos - thanks!
  Heather Forrest:We are just now getting started
  Carlos Raul:you go Heather pls
  Heather Forrest:ok
  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:scroll control??
  Nathalie  Peregrine:enabled
  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:thx
  Nathalie  Peregrine:Annebeth lange has joined the call
  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:I am all OK  with the BG part of the doc subject to the mnor edits and some format issues ( e.g. bottom of page 6)
  Nathalie  Peregrine:Annebeth is not on the Audio bridge, not has emabled her mic in the AC room
  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:Note  Deffinittion  is an orphanws  from the table  in my view of the doc... needs a page return  pre that word...
  Heather Forrest:Noted, thanks Cheryl
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):refernece to 6 on 6th page needs URL to the previous document
  Annebeth Lange:I have problems with the net, and with the sound
  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:Exactly Bart a commin issue with readers of our previous docs../ is to bring in 'Common Use' terms (geo I admot)   as "Territory"  when we mean the LISTED ones...
  Annebeth Lange:I don´t think you hear me
  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:No we don't Annabeth
  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:I'm OK  with the several terms  used in the deffinitions lstr as Heather proposes and A BIG  supporter of the Capitals  for Deffined Terms  use ;-)
  Annebeth Lange:Can you call me on 0047 959 11 559
  Annebeth Lange:I have problems with the sound
  Annebeth Lange:So do you mean that the territories in the ISO list should be taken out, Heather and Carlos?
  Heather Forrest:Not quite, Annebeth - that we have 3 separate definitions
  Heather Forrest:1. Country names, 2. Territory names, 3. Country and territory names
  Carlos Raul:only in the third one we refer to the ISO list
  Heather Forrest:Understood, Bart - there are political issues here
  Annebeth Lange:It is not us deciding what is countries. When UN decide a new country, that will be on the ISO list
  Annebeth Lange:So I agree, this is politics
  Joke Braeken:I agree Annebeth
  Annebeth Lange:And we must remember that our WG is working with c & t names as TLDs, not only as gTLDs
  Joke Braeken:exactly
  Carlos Raul:I agree Annebeth, and we should treat them chronologically
  Carlos Raul:1st cctlds
  Carlos Raul:and then, get into the gTLD workd
  Carlos Raul:world
  Heather Forrest:quite right, Bart- the terminology has always been an issue here
  Annebeth Lange:So what then, do you mean with countries in your suggested list 1?
  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:Agreement  from me on that Bart :-)
  Annebeth Lange:I agree strongly with Bart. RFC 1591 is the starting point.
  Annebeth Lange:No, it does not seem to work. COuld someone call me on 004795911559?
  Nathalie  Peregrine:of course!
  Heather Forrest:Thanks very much Nathalie
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):I think it is important to stick to established facts ... thus term geopolitical might be better to ommit
  Annebeth Lange:Carlos, yes, but it is the starting point for the countries and territories. The names of the countries and territories have gotten their code FROM their name
  Nathalie  Peregrine:Annebeth is now on te audio bidge
  Heather Forrest:Thank you Nathalia
  Heather Forrest:Nathalie....
  Nathalie  Peregrine::)
  Nathalie  Peregrine:Jaap Akkerhuis has joined the call
  Heather Forrest:Carlos - old hand or new hand?
  jaap akkehuis:Apologies for being late
  Heather Forrest:got it
  Heather Forrest:Welcome, Jaap. Thank you for joining us
  Carlos Raul:old hand
  Carlos Raul:sorry
  jaap akkehuis:The ISO standard has a definition what a country and territory is
  Carlos Raul:agree
  Carlos Raul:country and terrotyt according to ISO
  Carlos Raul:no regions
  Carlos Raul:Olga is here in Costa rica...
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):in 3166 'areas of geographical interest' and do we use  'areas of particular geopolitical interest'
  Carlos Raul:but busy with other stuff
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):?
  Carlos Raul:I just saw her
  Nathalie  Peregrine:Mirjana Tasic has joined the call
  Heather Forrest:Welcome Mirjana
  Carlos Raul:2 or 3 letter
  Mirjana Tasic:Heloo, I am soryy I am late
  Heather Forrest:Lost me?
  Heather Forrest:Mute!
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):geopolitical is fine since it is used by ISO
  Annebeth Lange:And when new countries are created, they will get a new 2-letter code
  Carlos Raul:introspection by Heather
  Carlos Raul:talking so herself
  Annebeth Lange:And a 3-letter code, and a 4-letter code
  Carlos Raul:2, 3 and 4 letter representation
  Carlos Raul:right
  Annebeth Lange:And in my view, Carlos, they kind of identify the countries
  Annebeth Lange:I do not think new territories will be established - that is historical, probably
  Carlos Raul:iprefer the langugae of the ccNS
  Carlos Raul:O paper
  Carlos Raul:the codes REPRESENT country names
  Annebeth Lange:THat is OK, Carlos, as long as we agree
  Annebeth Lange:I agree, Heather
  Carlos Raul:we agree
  Heather Forrest:Carlos - would you suggest we discuss this under the heading 'two letter strings'?
  Heather Forrest:Instead of 'two-letter codes'?
  Annebeth Lange:As we have talked about earlier, we have had .com from the start. I do not think Jon Postel then took the Comores 3-letter code. In the beginning it was clear that this meant COMMERCIAL, and because of that, no confusion
  Carlos Raul:in the ptions
  Carlos Raul:options
  Annebeth Lange:The problems giving away the 2-letter codes not assigned, is that we then makes it impossible for new countries to have "THEIR" 2-letter code
  Annebeth Lange:I think we clearly should deal with that in the options paper
  Annebeth Lange:I agree, Carlos
  Carlos Raul:right
  Annebeth Lange:I understand, Heather, where we discuss the different solutions
  jaap akkehuis:When you start to talk about using non assigned codes one should really make a difference between top level domains amd further down the tree
  Carlos Raul:we are cler
  Annebeth Lange:I agree with Jaap
  Annebeth Lange:If Jaap, you mean that those not assigned could be "free".
  Annebeth Lange:That is OK, Heater, as long as it is covered
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):do we have wording for the situation of "new ISO code created ' and gTLD is already in use?
  Annebeth Lange:I agree, Heather
  jaap akkehuis:That is why one to make the difference between TLDs and below.
  Heather Forrest:I would assume that any of our recommendations as a CWG are conditioned on the current use of ccTLDs with a recommendation that this be reviewed at a future point if codes are used differently
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):with 4 letters ... it is not that simple ... how to estimate demand for new subdivisions ... country want additional detalization for some reasons ... totally unpredictable ... potentially blocks all 4 letters
  Heather Forrest:We are not in a position to guess at future ccTLD policy
  Heather Forrest:Whether something is confusing depends on its use - very difficult to pre-determine the outcome
  Bart Boswinkel:What makes it difficult are the IDNs
  Laura Hutchison:I would suggest that a precedent has already been set with countries using 2 letter codes as ccTLDs.  This is understood by the end user. If we set up provisions/ protections for countries to use 3 or 4 letter codes then firstly this would create confusion for the end user as some 3 letter codes are ccTLs and others are gTLDs; and secondly, it makes for a very restrictive system that allows ccTLDs a "bigger slice of the pie" as Annebeth just said.
  Carlos Raul:of course Annebeth, and we should be cleqr on that
  Carlos Raul:excellent
  Annebeth Lange:Thanks, Laura, I am happy that I am not the only one having understood it this way
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):could we refer to historical reasons to protect all 2 letters
  Carlos Raul:I agree with Maxim
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):and only of existing 3 and 4 letters?
  Bart Boswinkel:No none
  Carlos Raul:but only the assinged ones
  Carlos Raul:all happy
  Annebeth Lange:Maxim, there is also political reasons to protect here
  Bart Boswinkel:Yes I am
  Annebeth Lange:Fine
  Carlos Raul:Hope I can go back to sleep.....good nite. Next time at 3pm my time please
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):thanks Everyone
  Ron Sherwood:Thank you all
  Bart Boswinkel:Bye all
  Laura Hutchison:Thanks. Bye everyone
  Heather Forrest:Thanks everyone - great progress
  Mirjana Tasic:Bye
  jaap akkehuis:By everymone, agan apologoes
  Nathalie  Peregrine:thank you!
  Heather Forrest:Thanks very much for all your support, Nathalie, Bart, Lars

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