[Ctn-crosscom] Attendance MP3 CTN meeting - Monday 30 March 2015

[Terri Agnew]

Dear All,

 Please find the MP3 recording for the Cross-Community Working Group on Use of Country/Territory Names as TLDs meeting held on Monday 30 March 2015 at 19:00 UTC at: http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-ccwg-unct-30mar15-en.mp3
On page:
http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#<http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#mar>m<http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#mar>ar<http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#mar>
The recordings and transcriptions of the calls are posted on the GNSO Master Calendar page:
http://gnso.icann.org/calendar/
Attendees:
ccNSO
Annebeth Lange, .no
Mirjana Tasic, .rs
Laura Hutchison, .uk
Grigori Saghyan, .am
Jacqueline Morris, .tt
Ron Sherwood, .vi

GNSO
Heather Forrest, IPC (Co-Chair)
Carlos Raul Guttierez, NPOC
Maxim Alzoba, NTAG
Colin O'Brien, IPC
Susan Payne, IPC

At-Large
Cheryl Langdon-Orr

ISO
Jaap Akkerhuis

Apologies:
Joke Braeken, .eu

ICANN staff:
Marika Konings
Mary Wong
Lars Hoffmann
Terri Agnew

** Please let me know if your name has been left off the list **
Mailing list archives:http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ctn-crosscom/
 Wiki page:https://community.icann.org/x/X7XhAg
Thank you.
Kind regards,
Terri Agnew

Adobe Connect chat transcript for Monday 30 March 2015:

  Terri Agnew:Dear all, welcome to the CCWG on Use of Country/ Territory Names as TLDs on the 30th March 2015

  Terri Agnew:Hi, this call will begin in 25 minutes

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):ok

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):no audio yet anyhow

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):thank you terri

  Terri Agnew:audio is ready now

  Grigori Saghyan:Hello!

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):Hello Grigori

  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):Hello Everybody

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):Hello Maxim

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):Question

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):waht does FAITID mean?

  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):Faoundation

  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):Foundation for Assistance for Internet Technologies and Infrastructure Development

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):ok

  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):registry for .moscow / .xn--80adxhks

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):ok thank you

  Lars Hoffmann:hey everybody

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):hello

  Annebeth Lange:Hi

  Heather Forrest:Good morning everyone

  Annebeth Lange:I should say good evening, here it is 9 pm

  Jaap Akkerhuis:Hi All

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:Hi All  only in AC  for  a while while I am also in another call...

  Jaap Akkerhuis:21:00 here as well

  Terri Agnew:Welcome Colin O'Brien

  Heather Forrest:I would like to say a few words about the changed structure since this follows on our last meeting

  Jaap Akkerhuis:Patagonia is nowehere mentioned

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):ok Heather

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):you are next

  Annebeth Lange:Exactly. Patagonia is not a territory in the ISO 3166 sense

  Heather Forrest:I won't interrupt this point so let's finish on ISo 3166 first

  Annebeth Lange:Patagonia is more a region

  Annebeth Lange:Jaap, I agree

  Jaap Akkerhuis:Apologies for the old hand

  Heather Forrest:thank you, Annebeth - glad you are happy with the approach

  Terri Agnew:Jacqueline Morris has joined

  Jaap Akkerhuis:I'kk add a definition of the ISO 3166-1 list

  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):lower left - we might need to chang

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:yes just muted

  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):e all to letter -> all two letter

  Jaap Akkerhuis:There are multiple ISO lists

  Jaap Akkerhuis:The list also is the base for IDNs

  Jaap Akkerhuis:It determines what is eligible to goe to the fast track process

  Laura Hutchison:I agree with Annebeth.  The status quo is very well establ.ished.  Changing this would create confusion for end users.

  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):countries do not use digits ... but they might use it in the future

  Jaap Akkerhuis:No, as longs as you follow ISO 3166, digits are not used

  Annebeth Lange:I agree, Heather, let us stay with the 2-letter codes for now

  Jaap Akkerhuis:There are also 4 letter codes in ISO 3166 (part 3)

  Annebeth Lange:I also agree with Laura, we should try to avoid creating confusion

  Terri Agnew:Ron Sherwood has joined

  Annebeth Lange:I agree, our mandate is for 2-letter and 3-letter codes

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:Agree also specify

  Jacqueline Morris:Agreed.

  Annebeth Lange:That will at least be very controversial, Heather, to go away from the ISO 3166 list

  Heather Forrest:apologies - that was a bit longwinded!

  Heather Forrest:I agree, Annebeth, and there may be technical issues

  Annebeth Lange:Remember what the AGB says about c & t names. Today c & t names and the extensions thereof are not allowed as gTLDs

  Heather Forrest:To clarify, my point was that in this discussion we should be considering the specific question: What should we do with 2-letter codes on the ISO 3166-2 list.

  Heather Forrest:In this context it does not make sense to be "moving away from lists" because the very question implicates the ISO 3166-2 list

  Heather Forrest:As I see it there are only 3 options:

  Heather Forrest:1. Status quo (reserve the ISO 3166-2 codes

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:Exactly Annebeth

  Heather Forrest:2. Remove reservation

  Heather Forrest:3. ISO 3166-2 is qualified - not automatially reserved but there is some framework

  Annebeth Lange:I agree

  Annebeth Lange:If we can finish our discussion on 2-letter codes first, that would be good

  Laura Hutchison:I think that the list is from an external source is a good thing

  Annebeth Lange:As Icann has said before, it is not them decided what is a country or a territory, that is UN

  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):reserving 2letter code for eternity is less pain than taking TLD code back ...

  Annebeth Lange:I agree with Maxim

  Annebeth Lange:And it will give new countries established in the future the same system as the old countries have today

  Jaap Akkerhuis:Since ISO taes codes back, maintaining TLDs for aver means serious conflicts in future

  Annebeth Lange:This is also bridging the digital divied

  Jacqueline Morris:Maintaining the TLD for eternity or reserving the code for eternity

  Laura Hutchison:I would agree.  The list is managed by an external body that is better placed than ICANN to decide and manage the list.  I would agree with Annebeth and Maxim about protection of codes for future countries.

  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):and old codes have their own afterlife ... like .su and .uk

  Jacqueline Morris:I thought it wass reserving for eternity - that allows for reuse, just as ISO does

  Jacqueline Morris:since they maintain the list

  Annebeth Lange:That is true, Jacqueline, if a 2-letter code is "retired" and taken back to ISO, it might be given to another country in the future, I think - as a ccTLD.

  Heather Forrest:Can anyone identify additional benefits and burdens of status quo to add to our list?

  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):reuse of TLD after retirement and re-birth by another country  ... cound be an issue of the future

  Heather Forrest:Good point, Maxim - this should go on the list

  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):good example

  Mirjana Tasic:I thing that Iso 3166 2 letter codes which has been used  cannot be reused for some period of time ( I think next 50 years?

  Heather Forrest:Confusion may become less an issue when we have a top-level with 1000 domains

  Jacqueline Morris:True...

  Annebeth Lange:But still, it is important that users know what is a ccTLD and what is a gTLD

  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):only 5 years before the next use

  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):if I am not mistaken

  Heather Forrest:Annebeth - that line is already blurred by generic use of ccTLDs

  Heather Forrest:If you want to keep the line clear we have to require that ccTLDs are used only within the country or for country purposes

  Heather Forrest:Carlos rightfully points out .co and .nu as examples

  Heather Forrest:.md is another

  Annebeth Lange:But Jaap, the codes represent names of countries and territories. .no is understood as a representation of Norway, for example

  Heather Forrest:It would be interesting to do a global survey to see if users at this time differentiate ccTLDs and gTLDs

  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):we might not ask for restrictions on cctlds ... limiting their ability to use ccTLD the way they want is well outside of our hands

  Annebeth Lange:I know that some countries decide to use their ccTLD more commercially, but still, it is the local internat community that has decided that.

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):Heather, i drafted a survey idea just after our meeting with the gAC

  Lars Hoffmann:here is a short definiton of the codes. http://www.iso.org/iso/home/standards/country_codes/country_codes_glossary.htm

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):lars

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):put it in the text please

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):in the definition lists

  Heather Forrest:I mean not a survey sent to governments but to internet users

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):I never send it out

  Lars Hoffmann:@carlos- will do that.

  Heather Forrest:Carlos - I don't disagree with you

  Jaap Akkerhuis:I have never said that the codes were used for statistical purposes

  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):Could we add wodring that possible dissolution of ISO 3166 and replacement with the next standard will cause the re-design of the document in a fast manner

  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):?

  Jaap Akkerhuis:It was in the early drafts and very quickly yanked

  Heather Forrest:Given that we have the status quo we have to decide what to do with the status quo - and the status quo involves the ISO list

  Laura Hutchison:Theoretical question but does it matter what the list was developed for?  Even if it was developed for statistical use, it is a reconised shorthand that links codes to country names?

  Jaap Akkerhuis:You wan to refer to the alpha-2 codes in Section 9 of ISO 3166-1

  Laura Hutchison:so it serves a purpose for the use to define ccTLDs

  Heather Forrest:I agree with Laura in terms of our discussion about what t do with status quo

  Heather Forrest:If we believe we need to deal with other codes not on ISO list then we have to question the reasoning

  Annebeth Lange:You mean, Heather, that we should stop the possibility for new countries to have their country code?

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):we need to leave a possibility for new  codes

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):by all means

  Annebeth Lange:I agree, Heather

  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):I agree - we need to avoid future issues with the removal of 2letter potential TLDs

  Annebeth Lange:We have to deal with the ISO list

  Heather Forrest:Thank you Carlos - a good summary

  Heather Forrest:Let's continue to work on the draft

  Heather Forrest:capture the comments from today

  Heather Forrest:and keep ging

  Annebeth Lange:And it is up to the local internet community in each country/territory how they will use their ccTLD, That is not up to us.

  Heather Forrest:Thank you Lars

  Heather Forrest:Let's revisit the time zones

  Heather Forrest:Carlos - this has been good, helpful robust discussion - well led

  Annebeth Lange:It is OK for me, the time of today. We have to take care of those having it too early in the morning

  Annebeth Lange:Thank you Carlos, for leading the call. Good work!

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):thank you all

  Jaap Akkerhuis:I need to drop off, Bye!

  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):some of WG conduct doodle polls for the time of meeting (+-1.5 hours)

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):thank you jaap

  Carlos Raul (GNSO):very good work

  Lars Hoffmann:no problem cheryl.

  Heather Forrest:Thank you everyone!

  Susan Payne - Valideus:thanks

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:Bye all  Thank yu

  Annebeth Lange:THanks and goodbye

  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):thanx Everybody!

  Lars Hoffmann:thank you - and have a good day/evening/night/morning everyone

  Ron Sherwood:Thank you all goodbye

  Mirjana Tasic:Bye

  Jacqueline Morris:thanks - bye

  Heather Forrest:Enjoy your holiday, Annebeth





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