[Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5] WT5 Agenda, Work Plan & Consensus Call on Country & Territory Names - Please review before our call.

Martin Sutton martin at brandregistrygroup.org
Tue Aug 7 09:05:32 UTC 2018


Apologies, I sent before finishing:

We will, as you can see from the work plan, cover broader categories and where we have  heard suggestions to improve the process and to .....

..consider different ways concerns can be managed, including curative processes.

Overall, the work plan is designed to help us progress discussions but also to build the set of recommendations based on what we have already covered (much of which has been previously discussed in other formal and informal ICANN groups over the past few years.

I hope this is helpful.

Kind regards,

Martin

Sent from my iPhone

On 7 Aug 2018, at 09:53, Martin Sutton <martin at brandregistrygroup.org<mailto:martin at brandregistrygroup.org>> wrote:

Thank you Katrin and others for comments and suggestions, this is helpful towards maximising our time on the call this week.

I thought it would be helpful to clarify the following in view of the exchanges below.

The draft proposed recommendations are limited to a sub-set of our deliberations, namely the country and territory names, where there was a good level of agreement (and compromise) to maintain the “conditions” that were applied to the AGB.

We will, as you can see from the work plan, cover broader categories and where we have  heard suggestions to improve the process and to

Sent from my iPhone

On 7 Aug 2018, at 09:15, Katrin Ohlmer | DOTZON GmbH <ohlmer at dotzon.com<mailto:ohlmer at dotzon.com>> wrote:

Hi All,

we could substitute „restrictions“ with „conditions “ to frame our discussion and recommendations in a positive manner,

kind regards
Katrin


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Von: Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 <gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces at icann.org<mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces at icann.org>> Im Auftrag von Kavouss Arasteh
Gesendet: Dienstag, 7. August 2018 10:11
An: Greg Shatan <gregshatanipc at gmail.com<mailto:gregshatanipc at gmail.com>>
Cc: Icann Gnso Newgtld Wg Wt5 <gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 at icann.org<mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 at icann.org>>
Betreff: Re: [Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5] WT5 Agenda, Work Plan & Consensus Call on Country & Territory Names - Please review before our call.

Carlos +1
Kavouss

On Tue, Aug 7, 2018 at 7:47 AM Greg Shatan <gregshatanipc at gmail.com<mailto:gregshatanipc at gmail.com>> wrote:
All,

Carlos wrote:

I just don't agree that the sole recommendation of WT5 that is going to be measure is a negative one: to restrict delegation of most geographic names. In my view recommendations should be framed in a positive manner, if possible.

This reminded me that we have so far talked almost exclusively about what are generally called "preventive" processes (reserve lists, permission requirements, blocking lists, etc.), and very little about what are generally called "curative" processes (objections, dispute resolution processes, challenge processes, etc.).  By doing so, we've taken half the tools out of the toolkit.

I just finished working on the reconvened IGO-INGO Preventive Rights WG where we were dealing (at this point) with reserving/restricting national Red Cross/Red Crescent society names.  In this case, a preventive rights approach made sense -- the names of the various national societies are essentially unique, identified only with that one entity, third party uses are almost certainly done in bad faith and with bad intent, and there's no real underlying policy disagreement.  In some cases (e.g., name collisions, certain reserved names) there is also a strong technical component.  This is how preventive rights have generally been used in ICANN policy -- for "slam-dunk" cases.

There are few, if any, "slam-dunk" cases in our work.  A good case can be made for 2-letter letter-letter combinations.  Perhaps a good case can be made for some of the remaining classifications in this first set or potential recommendations.  However, as we move "down the list", so to speak, we get further away from "slam-dunk" situations.  We could potentially make more headway on some of the classifications of names if we considered "curative" processes, instead of being so intensely focused on "preventive" rights.  This tends to turn our discussions into "all or nothing" choices -- but this is a false menu, since there are other options aside from the binary "all/nothing" that should be on the menu.

Let's keep this in mind as we move forward.

Greg



On Mon, Aug 6, 2018 at 6:34 PM Robin Gross <robin at ipjustice.org<mailto:robin at ipjustice.org>> wrote:
I agree with Paul and think we should declare agreement where we have it, and build on that to find other agreement down the line.  The process is supposed to involve incremental steps and building blocks along the way, and that is how we will eventually arrive at a consensus.  To take the “nothing until everything” approach will keep us spinning our wheels indefinitely, cause confusion, and risks unexpected results, which is in no one’s interest.

Best,
Robin

On Aug 6, 2018, at 2:16 PM, McGrady, Paul D. <PMcGrady at winston.com<mailto:PMcGrady at winston.com>> wrote:

I’m a little concerned with the “Nothing is agreed until everything is agreed” approach.  This isn’t a contract negotiation, it is a consensus building exercise.  If we have to wait until every topic has been discussed and we think we have 100% agreement on all topics before we take a consensus call on individual topics, this WG will never find an end point.

Best,
Paul



From: Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 <gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces at icann.org<mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces at icann.org>> On Behalf Of lists at christopherwilkinson.eu<mailto:lists at christopherwilkinson.eu> Wilkinson
Sent: Monday, August 6, 2018 4:09 PM
To: Martin Sutton <martin at brandregistrygroup.org<mailto:martin at brandregistrygroup.org>>
Cc: gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 at icann.org<mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 at icann.org>
Subject: Re: [Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5] WT5 Agenda, Work Plan & Consensus Call on Country & Territory Names - Please review before our call.


Dear Co-Leads and Martin:

I disagree with the method proposed.

1. It is premature to start consensus calls on certain restricted topics when other more critical topics have not yet been discussed.

2.  Nothing is agreed until everything is agreed.

Regards

CW




El 6 de agosto de 2018 a las 21:06 Martin Sutton <martin at brandregistrygroup.org<mailto:martin at brandregistrygroup.org>> escribió:

Hi Christopher,

In order to progress the building of the Initial Report, the agenda is designed to focus on how we will achieve this and begin to gather recommendations where we find consensus. Item 4 was raised on the last call and members were requested to continue discussions over the email list, although this has been somewhat quiet probably due to holiday periods.

We encourage you to use the email list for elaborating on non-AGB categories, this will then help towards further discussions on the call. By experience of the discussions relating to non-capital cities, please provide a sound argument/rationale for any suggestions for the group to consider, rather than simply stating a request.

Kind regards,

Martin
Sent from my iPhone

On 6 Aug 2018, at 15:25, lists at christopherwilkinson.eu<mailto:lists at christopherwilkinson.eu> Wilkinson <lists at christopherwilkinson.eu<mailto:lists at christopherwilkinson.eu>> wrote:

Dear Co-Leads:  May I request that point 4 of the proposed agenda be moved up to point 1.

Some participants, including myself, have only persevered with WT5 in-order to discuss the non-AGB terms.

These include :

-  all other geographical terms

-  geographical indications

-  several groups of regional, cultural, economic and linguistic names.

Thankyou and regards

Christopher Wilkinson
El 6 de agosto de 2018 a las 14:42 Martin Sutton <martin at brandregistrygroup.org<mailto:martin at brandregistrygroup.org>> escribió:
Dear Work Track members,

Please find below the proposed agenda for the WT5 call on Wednesday 8 August at 13:00 UTC:

1. Welcome/Agenda Review/SOI Updates
2. Review of Consensus Call Process and Work Plan
3. Consensus Call on Country and Territory Names
4. Wrap Up - Non-AGB Terms
5. AOB

On our upcoming call, the leadership team will introduce a work plan aimed at wrapping up WT5’s work and delivering an Initial Report by the end of September. In maintaining this timeline, the leadership is seeking to ensure that Work Track 5 inputs can be effectively integrated into the work of the broader New gTLD Subsequent Procedures PDP Working Group in time for delivery of the PDP’s Final Report. A copy of the work plan is attached.

As outlined in the work plan, the leadership team will be holding a series of consensus calls on potential recommendations to include in WT5’s Initial Report. These will be introduced in clusters, with the first set of recommendations focusing on country and territory names. The draft recommendations, which will be discussed on Wednesday, are attached. Work Track members are encouraged to review and provide feedback on these draft recommendations prior to the call on Wednesday. The leadership team will officially open the consensus call on this topic following Wednesday’s call. For more information on the consensus call process that will be followed, please see the GNSO Working Group Guidelines, Section 3.6:https://gnso.icann.org/sites/default/files/file/field-file-attach/annex-1-gnso-wg-guidelines-18jun18-en.pdf [gnso.icann.org]<https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Furldefense.proofpoint.com%2Fv2%2Furl%3Fu%3Dhttps-3A__gnso.icann.org_sites_default_files_file_field-2Dfile-2Dattach_annex-2D1-2Dgnso-2Dwg-2Dguidelines-2D18jun18-2Den.pdf%26d%3DDwMGaQ%26c%3DFmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM%26r%3DmBQzlSaM6eYCHFBU-v48zs-QSrjHB0aWmHuE4X4drzI%26m%3DNVtIpaem-VqCNPYPOoZhv9ofczsIO-e3-mM3UoaoTMA%26s%3Dg15pYjxotpxtjftphXYKDMOR0bso7mS5i2CXTIVfcww%26e%3D&data=02%7C01%7Cpmcgrady%40winston.com%7Cda9292b392304e149c7208d5fbe0d831%7C12a8aae45e2f4ad8adab9375a84aa3e5%7C0%7C0%7C636691865472632128&sdata=me4M2xocdDENZhUf8U%2FfsplZO3q09h%2FivOZ%2FOORwgPE%3D&reserved=0>.

If you need a dial out for the upcoming call or would like to send an apology, please email gnso-secs at icann.org<mailto:gnso-secs at icann.org>.

Kind regards,

WT5 Co-Leads
Annebeth Lange
Javier Rua
Olga Cavalli
Martin Sutton







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