[Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5] WT5 Agenda, Work Plan & Consensus Call on Country & Territory Names - Please review before our call.

Tue Aug 7 16:10:53 UTC 2018

Katrin,

That seems to be a semantic distinction without a substantive difference,
unless I misunderstand your point. How would conditions differ from
restrictions (or permissions, consents, non-objections, vetos, blocking
rights, preventive rights, pre-emotive rights, conditional reservations,
approvals, or any other term that has or could be used)?

Whatever the words, the substance seems to come down to either:

A.  A permission-type process where an application can’t move forward
unless a governmental authority allows it to move forward.
B.  A challenge-type process where an application can move forward unless a
governmental authority initiates a challenge process of some sort and
succeeds in that process.

We could come up with neutral terms (“apple” and “banana” for A and B
above) but we need to move beyond terminology and deal with substance.

Greg

On Tue, Aug 7, 2018 at 4:14 AM Katrin Ohlmer | DOTZON GmbH <
ohlmer at dotzon.com> wrote:

> Hi All,
>
>
>
> we could substitute „restrictions“ with „conditions “ to frame our
> discussion and recommendations in a positive manner,
>
>
>
> kind regards
>
> Katrin
>
>
>
>
>
> DOTZON GmbH - digital identities for tomorrow
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>
>
> *Von:* Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 <gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces at icann.org> *Im
> Auftrag von *Kavouss Arasteh
> *Gesendet:* Dienstag, 7. August 2018 10:11
> *An:* Greg Shatan <gregshatanipc at gmail.com>
> *Cc:* Icann Gnso Newgtld Wg Wt5 <gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 at icann.org>
> *Betreff:* Re: [Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5] WT5 Agenda, Work Plan & Consensus
> Call on Country & Territory Names - Please review before our call.
>
>
>
> Carlos +1
>
> Kavouss
>
>
>
> On Tue, Aug 7, 2018 at 7:47 AM Greg Shatan <gregshatanipc at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> All,
>
>
>
> Carlos wrote:
>
>
>
> I just don't agree that the sole recommendation of WT5 that is going to be
> measure is a negative one: to restrict delegation of most geographic names.
> In my view recommendations should be framed in a positive manner, if
> possible.
>
>
>
> This reminded me that we have so far talked almost exclusively about what
> are generally called "preventive" processes (reserve lists, permission
> requirements, blocking lists, etc.), and very little about what are
> generally called "curative" processes (objections, dispute resolution
> processes, challenge processes, etc.).  By doing so, we've taken half the
> tools out of the toolkit.
>
>
>
> I just finished working on the reconvened IGO-INGO Preventive Rights WG
> where we were dealing (at this point) with reserving/restricting national
> Red Cross/Red Crescent society names.  In this case, a preventive rights
> approach made sense -- the names of the various national societies are
> essentially unique, identified only with that one entity, third party uses
> are almost certainly done in bad faith and with bad intent, and there's no
> real underlying policy disagreement.  In some cases (e.g., name collisions,
> certain reserved names) there is also a strong technical component.  This
> is how preventive rights have generally been used in ICANN policy -- for
> "slam-dunk" cases.
>
>
>
> There are few, if any, "slam-dunk" cases in our work.  A good case can be
> made for 2-letter letter-letter combinations.  Perhaps a good case can be
> made for some of the remaining classifications in this first set or
> potential recommendations.  However, as we move "down the list", so to
> speak, we get further away from "slam-dunk" situations.  We could
> potentially make more headway on some of the classifications of names if we
> considered "curative" processes, instead of being so intensely focused on
> "preventive" rights.  This tends to turn our discussions into "all or
> nothing" choices -- but this is a false menu, since there are other options
> aside from the binary "all/nothing" that should be on the menu.
>
>
>
> Let's keep this in mind as we move forward.
>
>
>
> Greg
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 6, 2018 at 6:34 PM Robin Gross <robin at ipjustice.org> wrote:
>
> I agree with Paul and think we should declare agreement where we have it,
> and build on that to find other agreement down the line.  The process is
> supposed to involve incremental steps and building blocks along the way,
> and that is how we will eventually arrive at a consensus.  To take the
> “nothing until everything” approach will keep us spinning our wheels
> indefinitely, cause confusion, and risks unexpected results, which is in no
> one’s interest.
>
>
>
> Best,
>
> Robin
>
>
>
> On Aug 6, 2018, at 2:16 PM, McGrady, Paul D. <PMcGrady at winston.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> I’m a little concerned with the “Nothing is agreed until everything is
> agreed” approach.  This isn’t a contract negotiation, it is a consensus
> building exercise.  If we have to wait until every topic has been discussed
> and we think we have 100% agreement on all topics before we take a
> consensus call on individual topics, this WG will never find an end point.
>
>
>
> Best,
>
> Paul
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 <gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces at icann.org> *On
> Behalf Of *lists at christopherwilkinson.eu Wilkinson
> *Sent:* Monday, August 6, 2018 4:09 PM
> *To:* Martin Sutton <martin at brandregistrygroup.org>
> *Cc:* gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 at icann.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5] WT5 Agenda, Work Plan & Consensus
> Call on Country & Territory Names - Please review before our call.
>
>
>
> Dear Co-Leads and Martin:
>
> I disagree with the method proposed.
>
> 1. It is premature to start consensus calls on certain restricted topics
> when other more critical topics have not yet been discussed.
>
> 2.  Nothing is agreed until everything is agreed.
>
> Regards
>
> CW
>
>
>
>
>
> El 6 de agosto de 2018 a las 21:06 Martin Sutton <
> martin at brandregistrygroup.org> escribió:
>
> Hi Christopher,
>
>
>
> In order to progress the building of the Initial Report, the agenda is
> designed to focus on how we will achieve this and begin to gather
> recommendations where we find consensus. Item 4 was raised on the last call
> and members were requested to continue discussions over the email list,
> although this has been somewhat quiet probably due to holiday periods.
>
>
>
> We encourage you to use the email list for elaborating on non-AGB
> categories, this will then help towards further discussions on the call. By
> experience of the discussions relating to non-capital cities, please
> provide a sound argument/rationale for any suggestions for the group to
> consider, rather than simply stating a request.
>
>
>
> Kind regards,
>
>
>
> Martin
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
> On 6 Aug 2018, at 15:25, lists at christopherwilkinson.eu Wilkinson <
> lists at christopherwilkinson.eu> wrote:
>
> Dear Co-Leads:  May I request that point 4 of the proposed agenda be moved
> up to point 1.
>
> Some participants, including myself, have only persevered with WT5
> in-order to discuss the non-AGB terms.
>
> These include :
>
> -  all other geographical terms
>
> -  geographical indications
>
> -  several groups of regional, cultural, economic and linguistic names.
>
> Thankyou and regards
>
> Christopher Wilkinson
>
> El 6 de agosto de 2018 a las 14:42 Martin Sutton <
> martin at brandregistrygroup.org> escribió:
>
> Dear Work Track members,
>
>
>
> Please find below the proposed agenda for the WT5 call on Wednesday 8
> August at 13:00 UTC:
>
>
>
> 1. Welcome/Agenda Review/SOI Updates
> 2. Review of Consensus Call Process and Work Plan
> 3. Consensus Call on Country and Territory Names
> 4. Wrap Up - Non-AGB Terms
> 5. AOB
>
>
>
> On our upcoming call, the leadership team will introduce a work plan aimed
> at wrapping up WT5’s work and delivering an Initial Report by the end of
> September. In maintaining this timeline, the leadership is seeking to
> ensure that Work Track 5 inputs can be effectively integrated into the work
> of the broader New gTLD Subsequent Procedures PDP Working Group in time for
> delivery of the PDP’s Final Report. A copy of the work plan is attached.
>
>
>
> As outlined in the work plan, the leadership team will be holding a series
> of consensus calls on potential recommendations to include in WT5’s Initial
> Report. These will be introduced in clusters, with the first set of
> recommendations focusing on country and territory names. The draft
> recommendations, which will be discussed on Wednesday, are attached. *Work
> Track members are encouraged to review and provide feedback on these draft
> recommendations prior to the call on Wednesday*. The leadership team will
> officially open the consensus call on this topic following Wednesday’s
> call. For more information on the consensus call process that will be
> followed, please see the GNSO Working Group Guidelines, Section 3.6:
> https://gnso.icann.org/sites/default/files/file/field-file-attach/annex-1-gnso-wg-guidelines-18jun18-en.pdf
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> If you need a dial out for the upcoming call or would like to send an
> apology, please email gnso-secs at icann.org.
>
>
>
> Kind regards,
>
>
>
> WT5 Co-Leads
>
> Annebeth Lange
>
> Javier Rua
>
> Olga Cavalli
>
> Martin Sutton
>
>
>
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>
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