[gnso-rds-pdp-wg] Domain Name Management
Volker Greimann
vgreimann at key-systems.net
Fri Dec 8 16:20:15 UTC 2017
Historical data is not whois, it is a third party database.
Am 08.12.2017 um 17:13 schrieb allison nixon:
> >>Whois can be an indicator of ownership but it is not evidence.
>
> No, it is evidence and it has been used as evidence in the past. For
> example one case years ago when some Army domains were hijacked and
> the WHOIS data was changed to the name of a hacker gang. the
> historical whois data, the date of the change, and other factors were
> used as evidence for the timeline of events. And the people
> constructing that timeline were not working for the Army and didn't
> own the registrar account.
>
> On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 10:31 AM, Volker Greimann
> <vgreimann at key-systems.net <mailto:vgreimann at key-systems.net>> wrote:
>
> However, as registrars are required to roll back unwanted
> ownerchanges and transfers, such as those performed by a hijacker,
> what use is the whois record if at the time of the due diligence
> the whois does not reflect the legitimate ownership, but rather
> only the details of the criminal trying to flog what is not his?
>
> Whois can be an indicator of ownership but it is not evidence.
>
> Volker
>
>
> Am 08.12.2017 um 16:24 schrieb Sam Lanfranco:
>
> It might help to distinguish between two types of "prospective
> buyer" here. One is an unsolicited (possibly unwelcome)
> inquiry about purchase, and the other is an offer to buy based
> on an owner's intent to sell, or willingness to respond to a
> purchase query. In the first case the owner, and the
> registrar, have no obligation, and the interested party is
> left to its own devices. As well, neither requires deep access
> to the registration data.
>
> For someone taking over a domain name, one would expect that
> they would do due diligence both in cooperation with the
> seller, and throughout the nooks and crannies of the Internet
> ecosystem. Deeper access to RDS/whois type data would probably
> be a tiny part of that due diligence, and access to more
> private data is an issue between the buyer and the seller.
> There is scope for due diligence and dialogue outside the
> registration data, and domain names are not like products in a
> vending machine. One does not look through the glass, put
> money in the slot, and punch a button, with a URL falling out
> of the machine. It is a negotiation with due diligence. (my 2
> cents here)
>
> Sam L.
>
>
> On 12/8/2017 9:54 AM, Volker Greimann wrote:
>
> I would disagree. The only entities permitted to perform
> domain management actions, are the registrant, the
> registrar, and any agents deignated by them to perform
> these roles. A prospective buyer does not conduct domain
> management functions until he is entered as registrant.
>
>
> Am 08.12.2017 um 15:49 schrieb Andrew Sullivan:
>
> On Thu, Dec 07, 2017 at 12:55:54PM -0500, Sam
> Lanfranco wrote:
>
> Management (as a verb) is normally taken to mean
> the active engagement of
> the owner, or owner's contractually related
> parties, in the organization and
> coordination of the activities of a business in
> order to achieve defined
> objectives. Using the word "management" here
> suggests that we are limiting
> ourselves to what data elements are necessary to
> collect for the use of the
> domain name holder, the registrar and the
> registry. There are no other
> parties engaged in the "management" of the domain
> name.
>
> Correct?
>
> It seems to me that someone taking over a domain name
> -- that is, a
> prospective registrant or domain name holder -- is
> also another party,
> but perhaps that's just a variant on the above.
>
> Best regards,
>
> A
>
>
>
>
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>
> Volker A. Greimann
> - Rechtsabteilung -
>
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> Volker A. Greimann
> - legal department -
>
> Key-Systems GmbH
> Im Oberen Werk 1
> 66386 St. Ingbert
> Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901
> <tel:%2B49%20%280%29%206894%20-%209396%20901>
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--
Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen,
Volker A. Greimann
- Rechtsabteilung -
Key-Systems GmbH
Im Oberen Werk 1
66386 St. Ingbert
Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901
Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851
Email: vgreimann at key-systems.net
Web: www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net
www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com
Folgen Sie uns bei Twitter oder werden Sie unser Fan bei Facebook:
www.facebook.com/KeySystems
www.twitter.com/key_systems
Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin
Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken
Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534
Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP
www.keydrive.lu
Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen.
--------------------------------------------
Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us.
Best regards,
Volker A. Greimann
- legal department -
Key-Systems GmbH
Im Oberen Werk 1
66386 St. Ingbert
Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901
Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851
Email: vgreimann at key-systems.net
Web: www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net
www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com
Follow us on Twitter or join our fan community on Facebook and stay updated:
www.facebook.com/KeySystems
www.twitter.com/key_systems
CEO: Alexander Siffrin
Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken
V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534
Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP
www.keydrive.lu
This e-mail and its attachments is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. Furthermore it is not permitted to publish any content of this email. You must not use, disclose, copy, print or rely on this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, kindly notify the author by replying to this e-mail or contacting us by telephone.
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