[gnso-rds-pdp-wg] IMPROTANT - Action Items and Notes from Next-Generation RDS PDP Working Group Call - 17 May 2017

Gomes, Chuck cgomes at verisign.com
Thu May 18 18:57:00 UTC 2017 

As others have pointed out since I asked my question, load balancing may be done for reasons other than security.  My point is this:  restricting load balancing for security reasons only may be too restrictive.

Chuck

-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Keating [mailto:paul at law.es]
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2017 12:32 PM
To: Gomes, Chuck <cgomes at verisign.com>
Cc: benny at nordreg.se; gnso-rds-pdp-wg at icann.org
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [gnso-rds-pdp-wg] IMPROTANT - Action Items and Notes from Next-Generation RDS PDP Working Group Call - 17 May 2017

For systems integrity, yes.

Sent from my iPad

> On 18 May 2017, at 14:46, Gomes, Chuck <cgomes at verisign.com> wrote:
>
> Is load balancing always a security measure?
>
> Chuck
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org
> [mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org] On Behalf Of Paul Keating
> Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2017 6:18 AM
> To: benny at nordreg.se
> Cc: gnso-rds-pdp-wg <gnso-rds-pdp-wg at icann.org>
> Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [gnso-rds-pdp-wg] IMPROTANT - Action Items and
> Notes from Next-Generation RDS PDP Working Group Call - 17 May 2017
>
> I am agreeable only to those restrictions imposed as a security measure by the source (e.g. Load balancing, etc).
>
> Paul
>
>> On 5/18/17, 12:06 PM, "benny at nordreg.se" <benny at nordreg.se> wrote:
>>
>> There can be technical issues where you need to do so, that was
>> pointed out during the call
>> --
>> Med vänliga hälsningar / Kind Regards / Med vennlig hilsen
>>
>> Benny Samuelsen
>> Registry Manager - Domainexpert
>>
>> Nordreg AB - ICANN accredited registrar
>> IANA-ID: 638
>> Phone: +46.42197080
>> Direct: +47.32260201
>> Mobile: +47.40410200
>>
>>> On 18 May 2017, at 11:59, Paul Keating <Paul at law.es> wrote:
>>>
>>> Yes, the CURRENT issue is Thin Data only.
>>>
>>> My comment was indented to deal with what I understood to be a
>>> re-assertion that THIN DATA be subject to access restriction.
>>>
>>> To reiterate,  There is no basis to restrict THIN DATA (IMHO) for
>>> the simple reason that there is no Personal ID Data in the set.  Nor
>>> are there any intellectual property rights in THIN DATA.
>>>
>>> That means anyone can harvest what they want subject only to load
>>> balancing restrictions imposed by the source from which the data is
>>> being harvested.
>>>
>>> Paul
>>>
>>> From: <gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org> on behalf of Chris Pelling
>>> <chris at netearth.net>
>>> Date: Thursday, May 18, 2017 at 11:46 AM
>>> To: gnso-rds-pdp-wg <gnso-rds-pdp-wg at icann.org>
>>> Subject: Re: [gnso-rds-pdp-wg] IMPROTANT - Action Items and Notes
>>> from Next-Generation RDS PDP Working Group Call - 17 May 2017
>>>
>>>> Got to agree with Andrew on this - my thoughts on thin is exactly
>>>> what Verisign shows now which is basically domain name, dates,
>>>> registrar, nameservers and status << That is the common term of "THIN DATA".
>>>>
>>>> As I said, thin data I have no issues with, even data harvesting
>>>> companies having it lawfully.
>>>>
>>>> Kind regards,
>>>>
>>>> Chris
>>>>
>>>> From: "Andrew Sullivan" <ajs at anvilwalrusden.com>
>>>> To: "Paul Keating" <paul at law.es>
>>>> Cc: "gnso-rds-pdp-wg" <gnso-rds-pdp-wg at icann.org>
>>>> Sent: Thursday, 18 May, 2017 00:52:33
>>>> Subject: Re: [gnso-rds-pdp-wg] IMPROTANT - Action Items and Notes from
>>>>      Next-Generation RDS PDP Working Group Call - 17 May 2017
>>>>
>>>> No, the data we are currently discussing is thin data.  Among it, I
>>>> believe only the domain name and maybe the name servers are entered
>>>> by the registrant, and both of those are required if there is to be
>>>> a domain name that works on the Internet.
>>>>
>>>> I find it quite frustrating that we do not seem to be able, as a
>>>> group, to keep these elementary distinctions before us during
>>>> discussion.
>>>>
>>>> A
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Andrew Sullivan
>>>> Please excuse my clumbsy thums.
>>>>
>>>>> On May 17, 2017, at 18:06, Paul Keating <paul at law.es> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Licensing what and from whom?
>>>>>
>>>>> This is data entered by the registrant.  Privacy issues apply only
>>>>> to the subset of individuals.
>>>>>
>>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 17 May 2017, at 23:38, Greg Shatan <gregshatanipc at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> One way to deal with harvesters is through a licensing set-up.
>>>>>> There are legitimate reasons to have the full dataset, and these
>>>>>> should be accommodated in a controlled environment.  Preventing
>>>>>> bad harvesters is worthwhile, prevent all harvesting is another
>>>>>> issue entirely....
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Greg Shatan
>>>>>> C: 917-816-6428
>>>>>> S: gsshatan
>>>>>> gregshatanipc at gmail.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, May 17, 2017 at 3:00 PM, Michael Peddemors
>>>>>> <michael at linuxmagic.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 17-05-17 10:46 AM, Jeremy Malcolm wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 17/5/17 9:40 am, Michael Peddemors wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Yes, this is the common argument, however IMHO this is a red
>>>>>>>>> herring..
>>>>>>>>> There are more efficient ways for 'harvesters' to gain data,
>>>>>>>>> and  others way to prevent such abuse..
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Again, IMHO this argument is another case of impacting the
>>>>>>>>> many legitimate users, for the sake of a few bad apples..
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> And I havent' seen any arguments yet, of a case scenario which
>>>>>>>>> can't  be addressed by other means..
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> So to reverse this, what are the *legitimate* purposes of
>>>>>>>> harvesting?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Who said anything about arguing for 'harvesting' as a legitimate
>>>>>>> purpose?  I didn't, and even pointed out that there are way(s)
>>>>>>> to target harvesters..
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I was pointing out the legitimate purposes of accessing the data..
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And many of those cases have already been stated, I could
>>>>>>> re-iterate those arguments, and give examples of why 'we' need
>>>>>>> to access the data, but again, 'harvesting' is different than access.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Arguing that we 'have to stop harvesters' by denying access to
>>>>>>> the data for legitimate purposes was the original point.  There
>>>>>>> are other means to target those perpetrators..  But it shouldn't
>>>>>>> be used as a 'scary boogeyman' exists, so everyone lock your doors.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> To paraphrase.. "Just because criminals exist, doesn't mean that
>>>>>>> civilians can't walk the street".  That is a 'gut reaction' of
>>>>>>> fear, and not a solution.  Better policing, targeting criminals,
>>>>>>> or carry a big stick solves that :)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Nuff said.. as I said, lets' place case scenario's and argument
>>>>>>> each on their merits.. and not react to a 'undefinable' threat..
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> "Catch the Magic of Linux..."
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> ---
>>>>>>> ---
>>>>>>> Michael Peddemors, President/CEO LinuxMagic Inc.
>>>>>>> Visit us at http://www.linuxmagic.com @linuxmagic
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> ---
>>>>>>> ---
>>>>>>> A Wizard IT Company - For More Info http://www.wizard.ca
>>>>>>> "LinuxMagic" a Registered TradeMark of Wizard Tower
>>>>>>> TechnoServices Ltd.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>> --
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