[gnso-rds-pdp-wg] Contactability
John Bambenek
jcb at bambenekconsulting.com
Tue Nov 28 19:57:25 UTC 2017
Full agreement on this point
On 11/28/2017 01:30 PM, Kris Seeburn wrote:
> As we move on …one way or the other the GDPR and other aligned privacy
> laws will catch up eventually. We will need to find levels and
> technical ways and reasons to get things to work. We move to RDAPis
> fine as we look ahead but we should be able to not only look at the
> laws that we need to respect but also to find technical ways to get
> and make sure things still continue towork. As this stage personally
> both are as important.
>
>> On Nov 28, 2017, at 23:15, allison nixon <elsakoo at gmail.com
>> <mailto:elsakoo at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> Most systems operators are not afraid to block entire TLDs. While
>> there are no scientific studies out on this matter AFAIK, the help
>> forums are littered with people asking how to block entire TLDs, and
>> also registrants on those TLDs asking why everyone is blocking them.
>> It's enough to conclusively say this is already an issue, and we can
>> thank abuse for this.
>>
>> In this Reddit post, a user learns the hard truth about his brand new
>> XYZ domain:
>> https://www.reddit.com/r/webdev/comments/6jq6f5/getting_blocked_should_i_abandon_my_xyz_domain/
>>
>> This article discusses Facebook's block of all XYZ domains:
>> http://adamyamada.com/facebook-blocks-xyz-domains-new-domains-pages/
>>
>> This Malwarebytes staff member explains to a legitimate registrant
>> that all .SCIENCE TLDs are blocked and he gets no exception:
>> https://forums.malwarebytes.com/topic/173535-all-my-science-domains-blocked/
>>
>> In fact, the Malwarebytes "false positive" forum is littered with
>> owners of hacked domains that discovered their problem because of a
>> block, not because of a notification:
>> https://forums.malwarebytes.com/forum/123-website-blocking/
>>
>> This user asks for an 'Existing list of garbage "new" TLDs' to block
>> https://vamsoft.com/forum/topic/597/existing-list-of-garbage-new-tlds
>>
>> There are 179 Google search results for people asking Microsoft's
>> help service for ways to block entire TLDs:
>> https://www.google.com/search?q=how+do+i+block+TLD+site:answers.microsoft.com
>>
>> There are 72,500 Google search results for "how to block" "tld":
>> https://www.google.com/search?q=%22how+to+block%22+%22tld%22
>>
>> The Internet is effectively "broken" for any legitimate registrants
>> on these TLDs.
>>
>> As a seller of some of those same TLDs, should you be concerned if
>> your customers purchase domains rendered useless due to blocking?
>> Would you actually refund a customer if they told you they couldn't
>> use the domain for e-mail due to the TLD?
>> Would you warn your prospective .XYZ, .STUDY, .PRESS, .PARTY, etc,
>> customers that they should not use the domains for e-mail?
>> When ICANN releases new gTLDs in the future, do you think that those
>> domains will ever be able to send e-mail?
>>
>> Truly, the rest of the world will be fine. The more that ICANN has
>> the "not my problem" attitude, the more the rest of the world is
>> going to push back. ICANN seems to have lost the ability to release
>> new gTLDs without severe connectivity issues, so we also need to ask
>> the question: "why are these guys selling the digital equivalent of
>> the scarlet letter and not warning their customers beforehand?"
>>
>> I think the question of selling defective products is one that needs
>> to be addressed more seriously by regulators and outside parties.
>>
>> I can also tell you that security vendors are already looking into
>> other anti-abuse techniques for domains post-WHOIS, and I can also
>> tell you that they will result in an increase in the percentage of
>> legitimate domains that are blocked. This is your problem now.
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 28, 2017 at 12:43 PM, Volker Greimann
>> <vgreimann at key-systems.net <mailto:vgreimann at key-systems.net>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Andrew,
>>
>> re:hotbed I was rather intending to ask whether there is a direct
>> correllation between TLDs with redacted whois and issues that go
>> unresolved. So do you have more unresolved issues in .co.uk
>> <http://co.uk/> than in .com (if numbers are normalized for
>> registered domain names).
>>
>> I am sure no one would consider blocking the entire mail traffic
>> originating from the United Kingdom Top Level Domain just because
>> you cannot resolve some issues in a few domains, correct?
>>
>> So if everyone followed their (or a similar) model, the internet
>> would not break. Some issues would get harder to solve (or take
>> longer). I am asking because that is what most likely will happen
>> on May 25 or sooner.
>>
>> Volker
>>
>>
>>
>> Am 28.11.2017 um 18:27 schrieb Andrew Sullivan:
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 28, 2017 at 04:31:56PM +0100, Volker Greimann wrote:
>>
>> case of internet operability issues. While I appreciate
>> that there can be
>> issues that would necessitate the ability to quickly
>> contact whoever can fix
>> the issue, I wonder how this problem is solved in TLDs
>> where whois is
>> already redacted.
>>
>> It's not. In that case, if I am the one who has this
>> experience and I
>> can't reach the target, then the problem goes unresolved. In
>> mail
>> cases, as John suggests elsewhere in this thread, the answer
>> is very
>> likely that mail is blocked. People seem surprised these
>> days that
>> mail is so fragile, but this sort of thing is part of the reason.
>>
>> So how does it work there? Are these TLDs hotbeds of DNS
>> issues and
>> unresolved problems?
>>
>> I don't know what you mean by "hotbed", or whether that is
>> intended to
>> be dismissive. Some TLDs defintely have more DNS problems than
>> others. Given how hard the DNS works to make connections
>> happen even
>> when things are badly misconfigured, lots of stuff will work
>> to some
>> extent even when it is badly configured. But DNS operations
>> people
>> trade stories about problems amongst themselves, after giving
>> up on
>> sites because whois can't help and the mname in the SOA record is
>> broken. I find this happens more often than you might expect.
>>
>> But yes, there are broken domains on the Internet. I find it
>> hard to
>> believe that would be even slightly remarkable.
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> A
>>
>>
>> --
>> Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.
>>
>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen,
>>
>> Volker A. Greimann
>> - Rechtsabteilung -
>>
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>>
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>>
>> --------------------------------------------
>>
>> Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to
>> contact us.
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> Volker A. Greimann
>> - legal department -
>>
>> Key-Systems GmbH
>> Im Oberen Werk 1
>> 66386 St. Ingbert
>> Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901
>> <tel:%2B49%20%280%29%206894%20-%209396%20901>
>> Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851
>> <tel:%2B49%20%280%29%206894%20-%209396%20851>
>> Email: vgreimann at key-systems.net <mailto:vgreimann at key-systems.net>
>>
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>> www.RRPproxy.net <http://www.rrpproxy.net/>
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>>
>>
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>> --
>> _________________________________
>> Note to self: Pillage BEFORE burning.
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>
>
>
>
> Kris Seeburn
> seeburn.k at gmail.com <mailto:seeburn.k at gmail.com>
>
> *
>
> www.linkedin.com/in/kseeburn/
> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/kseeburn/>
>
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