[gnso-rpm-wg] Recordings, attendance & AC Chat from Review of all Rights Protection Mechanisms (RPMs) PDP Working Group call on 09, August 2017 17:00 UTC

Michelle DeSmyter michelle.desmyter at icann.org
Wed Aug 9 22:00:03 UTC 2017

Dear All,

Please find the attendance of the call attached to this email. The MP3, Adobe Connect recording and Adobe Connect chat below for the Review of all Rights Protection Mechanisms (RPMs) PDP Working Group call held Thursday, 09 August 2017at 17:00 UTC. Attendance of the call is posted on agenda wiki page: https://community.icann.org/x/aA4hB

MP3: http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-rpm-review-09aug17-en.mp3<http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-rpm-review-09aug17-en.mp3[mailer.samanage.com]>

Adobe Connect recording: https://participate.icann.org/p97fhhslzvg/

The recordings and transcriptions of the calls are posted on the GNSO Master Calendar page:http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar[gnso.icann.org]<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__gnso.icann.org_en_group-2Dactivities_calendar&d=DwMF-g&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=8_WhWIPqsLT6TmF1Zmyci866vcPSFO4VShFqESGe_5iHWGlBLwwwehFBfjrsjWv9&m=VqOOufta7uIGpIGDJ5U1cepLELhCsPPoZZC9osq3Hrk&s=eBrYQigfSiOfET2VcOvNtKoUgJHCm4qXeW7zA-dR-is&e=>

** Please let me know if your name has been left off the list **

Mailing list archives: http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-rpm-wg/

Wiki page: https://community.icann.org/x/aA4hB

Thank you.

Kind regards,


Adobe Connect chat transcript for 09 August 2017:

Michelle DeSmyter:Dear All, Welcome to the Review of all Rights Protection Mechanisms (RPMs) in all gTLDs PDP WG call on Wednesday, 09 August 2017 at 17:00 UTC.
  Michelle DeSmyter:Agenda wiki page: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_aA4hB&d=DwICaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=8_WhWIPqsLT6TmF1Zmyci866vcPSFO4VShFqESGe_5iHWGlBLwwwehFBfjrsjWv9&m=cYgtjV4k8YOLUz8vaTYnezwsPPucU6a90NC0CCZ-wus&s=Q1UpilfvBm2l87yoCezrUbhYJ_A3kSF_B_lhozOvY2A&e=
  George Kirikos:Hi folks. On iPad today, as I wait for some couriers, so just a boring black font for me. :-(
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):Hello All
  Jonathan Frost:Hi Maxim
  George Kirikos:Welcome, Maxim.
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):I suggest we wait 5 minutes more
  George Kirikos:Maybe send out a reminder email?
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):so number of participants at least bigger than of that 3AM call
  George Kirikos:lol
  Paul Tattersfield:Hi Everyone
  George Kirikos:Hey Paul.
  Mary Wong:We actually had 20 participants (not counting staff) on the call last week
  Paul Tattersfield:Hi George, how's things in Canada, Autumn/Fall seems to be coming very eary this year - first week in August is it the same in Canada?
  David McAuley:has call started - just hearing periodic beeps
  George Kirikos:Things are pretty good. Warm but not hot.
  David McAuley:Thanks Mary
  Philip Corwin:Hello from Maine. On Adobe only.
  David McAuley:oops
  David McAuley:did anyone else lose audio?
  Kristine Dorrain - Amazon Registry Services:I"m on the phone bridge - no
  George Kirikos 2:Audio ok here.
  David McAuley:thanks
  Lori Schulman:I lost audio on the phone
  George Kirikos 2:(I'm on the phone bridge too)
  Amr Elsadr:Note that the INTA Survey results have been posted on the WG wiki here: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_0AusAw&d=DwICaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=8_WhWIPqsLT6TmF1Zmyci866vcPSFO4VShFqESGe_5iHWGlBLwwwehFBfjrsjWv9&m=cYgtjV4k8YOLUz8vaTYnezwsPPucU6a90NC0CCZ-wus&s=pKKEmVEwBPi79lbNW1rCnnM1csvI6DDh3Hw9WNlPi68&e=
  David McAuley:I lost audio on phone as well - using adobe only now
  Lori Schulman:I have no audio on phone and none when I try to activate in Adobe.
  Lori Schulman:INTA is happy to work with this group to see where the study results can be appropriately applied to Sunrise, Claims and TMCH
  David McAuley:typist please mute
  George Kirikos 2:I can hear you, Lori.
  George Kirikos 2:(she might not be able to hear us)
  Mary Wong:Go ahead, Lori
  Lori Schulman:I can't hear anyone.  Sorry for the typing
  Susan Payne:yes we can hear her
  Brian Cimbolic:just typing
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):I hear Lori
  David McAuley:i cannot hear Lori anymore on adobe
  J. Scott:ok
  Scott Austin:I hear her
  Mary Wong:Yes plesae, Lori
  David McAuley:now i can
  J. Scott:yes
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):I hear on Adobe
  J. Scott:thanks
  J. Scott:mary
  J. Scott:thanks lori
  George Kirikos 2:Can ICANN send out a press release, to ensure that public input (and provision of data) is maximized for this work?
  George Kirikos 2:That would help ensure that there's some outreach to those outside the "usual" circles.
  George Kirikos 2:(this is for all the questions, not any specific one)
  Mary Wong:@J Scott, that is correct - and these sources were suggested by the Sub Team/WOrking Group (i.e. not staff)
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):NOTE: regarding 3, Registries provided at least 3 examples (and since there were no letter to RySG/RrSG, should be more)
  George Kirikos 2:Given the issues with the most recent SurveyMonkey survey, that might be wise.
  Lori Schulman:I would share after INTA's experience, that even though we had expert advice, there were still some inefficiencies in the survey.  Extensive beta testing is key in my opinion in terms of ferreted out bias and making sure that the answers are clear
  Mary Wong:Will do, J Scott
  George Kirikos 2:Any final survey should be circulated to the main group's mailing list, though, before it goes live, just as a final check.
  Kristine Dorrain - Amazon Registry Services:+1 Lori
  Paul Tattersfield:+1 George
  George Kirikos 2:Sunrise pricing could also be obtained through registrants/registrars, if registries don't cooperate.
  George Kirikos 2:(albeit, there'd be a markup from the wholesale price)
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):I am not sure 3 samples will be enough to approximate properly - there are different pricing ideas on the market
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):more than 3
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):+1 Kristine, TM owners pay to Registrars
  George Kirikos 2:Doubtful we'd get the wholesale prices, though.
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):some Registries publish prices , some do not
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):and there is not such thing as Wholesale price
  George Kirikos 2:@Maxim: "wholesale" = price from registry to registrar.
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):it is under NDA mostly
  George Kirikos 2:"retail" = price paid by registrant/markholder to registrar.
  George Kirikos 2:No NDAs by registrants.
  George Kirikos 2:Most registrars will probably have a fixed percentage markup for sunrises, so we'd get the appropriate scale.
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):and Registries can not say Registrars the price of end-user sale (sometimes under special marketing initiative it can be set, for example particular price for end-users suring the particular period to promote domains names)
  George Kirikos 2:(i.e. fixed percentage within a registrar; so all sunrise prices at Markmonitor could be compared with each other, or at CSC, etc.; not compared across registrars)
  Kristine Dorrain - Amazon Registry Services:To Maxim's point, resellers also mark up price.
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):@George, the registrants are pure 3rd parties for Registries
  Kristine Dorrain - Amazon Registry Services:@Greg, you have no basis to assume registrars charge a flat percentage mark up.
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):+1 Kristine, sometimes there are special across-TLDs incentives e.t.c.
  George Kirikos 2:The "basis" is that most registrars use the "KISS" principle, keeping pricing models simple.
  Susan Payne:the trouble is not all registrars will want to give their mark up. they are likley to view it as confidential, at least insofar as their competitors are concerned.  and it may vary from client to client as well.  Maybe not for the retail registrars who publish pricing on their websites but a lot of them didn't participate in sunrise
  Philip Corwin:As registrars compete in a fairly transparent market, can we assume that inhibits exorbitant markups by any particular registrar?
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):I think we need to add a disclaimer "we assume this model to be used, and thus ..."
  George Kirikos 2:If the retail price of .TLD1 sunrise is twice the retail price of TLD2 sunrise, at a given registrar, it's safe to assume the wholesale costs at TLD1 are higher.
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):anyway - 3 samples is not representative enough
  Mary Wong:@J Scott, that is what staff is thinking we could approach it
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):@George , it is an assumption ... unfortunately marketing guys are extremely inventive and it is reflected in quite complex math equations of pricing
  George Kirikos 2:We don't need to ask the registrars -- can ask Apple, Dell, Microsoft, etc. (regular users of sunrise periods). They're not bound by confidentiality of what price they paid.
  George Kirikos 2:Just lost sound?
  Kristine Dorrain - Amazon Registry Services:did we lose Mary
  George Kirikos 2:Sound is back.
  George Kirikos 2:@maxim: true, it's an assumption, but it can be validated by looking at users who used MarkMonitor, CSC, etc. (i.e. across registrars, by their registranrs).
  Mary Wong:Adobe sound seems to be acting up; suggest people call in to the bridge if you can
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):Could we outreach to SO/ACs ?
  Cyntia King:really choppy audio
  David McAuley:audio is not the best today
  Greg Shatan:Bubbles
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):speed rewind buffer sound
  Sara Bockey (GoDaddy):audio is on fast forward
  Jonathan Frost:+1 Kristine
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):I hoped for online
  Greg Shatan:Susan sounds normal.
  Mary Wong:Please dial into the audio bridge
  Kristine Dorrain - Amazon Registry Services:I do talk fast....  :)
  Kristine Dorrain - Amazon Registry Services:but now Susan is fast too....
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):timeshifting issues
  Kristine Dorrain - Amazon Registry Services:Audio bridge is also fast
  George Kirikos 2:The Buiness Constituency seems to have kept some records of sunrise prices, e.g. see blog post at: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__domainincite.com_18651-2Dare-2Dnew-2Dgtld-2Dregistries-2Dripping-2Doff-2Dbrands-2Dwith-2Dunfair-2Dsunrise-2Dfees&d=DwICaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=8_WhWIPqsLT6TmF1Zmyci866vcPSFO4VShFqESGe_5iHWGlBLwwwehFBfjrsjWv9&m=cYgtjV4k8YOLUz8vaTYnezwsPPucU6a90NC0CCZ-wus&s=XB-Td4hMCOBH0U0WABHuX_hYb2VS_bSqNJ9i9K4OyMY&e=
  Greg Shatan:J Scott shaky sounding too
  Scott Austin:accellerated speech
  George Kirikos 2:Facebook.love for $8,930
  Susan Payne:should we all log out and restart the meeting - this isn't workig very well?
  Michelle DeSmyter:It is
  Louise Marie Hurel:yes
  Kristine Dorrain - Amazon Registry Services:you just cut out again for a second.
  Cyntia King:Agree w/ Susan
  Kristine Dorrain - Amazon Registry Services:Yes, now ok
  Susan Payne:too fast
  Cyntia King:choppy
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):too fast
  David McAuley:yes
  Greg Shatan:Mary your sound went downhill fast.
  Paul Tattersfield:very fast here with pauses
  Susan Payne:no it's not better
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):could we log out , and re-log?
  Greg Shatan:This is a technical glitch.
  David McAuley:sound getting worse - hard to imagine
  Steve Levy:Speakers are cutting in and out and the audio is sped-up when it returns
  Louise Marie Hurel:No, it is difficult to follow with the audio
  Michelle DeSmyter:trying to resolve
  George Kirikos 2:Sound fine here (telephone bridge). Perhaps dial back in, if you're having troubles.
  Paul Tattersfield:no its very difficult to follow
  Philip Corwin:Yes, sounds like everyone is on amphetamines and then passing out ;-)
  Greg Shatan:"Under the sea..."
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):I will try to speak slowly
  Mary Wong:Yes
  Kristine Dorrain - Amazon Registry Services:you're cutting out
  Michelle DeSmyter:It seems there are audio issues when using the Adobe Connect room today, I am contact IT to look into this ASAP, if you are able to use your phone connection you will receive a better connection until this is resolved.  I apologize for the inconvenience.
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):what makes me wonder is that high speed effect needs sound to be pre recorded ... so it could be due to trafic loss and attdmpts of the system to squeese sound into "good quality gaps" of time
  Paul Tattersfield:this stuff is too  important to carry on like this
  Philip Corwin:I don't have a phone option. Audio very difficult to follow -- doublespeed, then silence
  Greg Shatan:On iPad just a constant choppiness.
  Scott Austin:+1 Maxim
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):I loose most letters in the speach.. we need to speak extremely slowly to compensate the sound effects
  Mary Wong:Sorry, Maxim, noted for next time, thank you
  Greg Shatan:Waiting to be dialed in...
  George Kirikos 2:Perhaps pause the call for 5 mins, to let those with audio issues dial in?
  George Kirikos 2:(if it's a mass problem -- audio is fine for me0
  Sara Bockey:no audio after logging back in
  David McAuley:trying to dial back in - adobe audio in a funk today
  Cyntia King:Audio much better on dial-in.   Thanks Michelle DeSmyter.
  Greg Shatan:Audio good on dial-in.
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):sound is way better on Skype to toll free +1866-692-5726 (cost 0.00 per minute)
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):so it is possible to mute on Adobe and use sound from Skype
  Scott Austin:Comments in article referenced by G. Kirikos comment above worth reviewing for pro and con on premium Surise pricing issue.
  Cyntia King:Media useful for exceptions, not rule.
  George Kirikos 2:Weren't the business plans of new gTLD applicants public? (might be another source of data)
  Lori Schulman:I gave up on Adobe audio almost an hour ago.
  David McAuley:I left adobe - on phone and it is ok
  George Kirikos 2:i.e. what they promised to ICANN, vs. what they delivered.
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):skype works
  Lori Schulman:sorry
  Paul Tattersfield:I left adobe for the phone
  Lori Schulman:but I love you
  George Kirikos 2:lol
  Cyntia King:Media, however, often leads public perccception so may be useful to gauge current trends.
  Philip Corwin:I just called in on skype. Adobe audio was useless today
  Jonathan Frost:@George: Much of the applications were public, but financial projections were kept confidential.
  Sara Bockey:not able to dial in and no audio in AC
  Scott Austin:Reactions to the articles in comments can be of as much value as the original article.
  George Kirikos 2:@Jonathan: maybe they can be aggregated/anonymized, then?
  George Kirikos 2:e.g. average expected number of sunrises was N, average expected price was $X; and compare to our data on actual results.
  George Kirikos 2:(albeit, at retail vs. wholesale)
  David McAuley:yes
  Lori Schulman:we can hear you on the phone
  Michelle DeSmyter:you are
  Amr Elsadr:Apologies..., that was me being dropped off the call.
  George Kirikos 2:Some of the companies (e.g. Rightside, MMX) have public financial statements, too, which might be a source of data, since they're publicly traded.
  George Kirikos 2:ICANN Monthly Reports
  George Kirikos 2:https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.icann.org_resources_pages_registry-2Dreports&d=DwICaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=8_WhWIPqsLT6TmF1Zmyci866vcPSFO4VShFqESGe_5iHWGlBLwwwehFBfjrsjWv9&m=cYgtjV4k8YOLUz8vaTYnezwsPPucU6a90NC0CCZ-wus&s=OJru4QPqqiJ-5l6cK0oW-sbY2dEY2RV1daxys6k_wsI&e=
  Michelle DeSmyter:Please stand by, we are still having Adobe Connect issues and we do encourage you to dial into the phone bridge to hear the conference if you are continuing to experience audio issues.
  George Kirikos 2:gTLD.link is a forum focused on new gTLDs (I'm not a member of it, but there'd be some info there too, conceivably)
  George Kirikos 2:A search of 'sunrise' has only 36 matches, though: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__gtld.link_search-3Fq-3Dsunrise-26searchJSON-3D-257B-2522keywords-2522-253A-2522sunrise-2522-257D&d=DwICaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=8_WhWIPqsLT6TmF1Zmyci866vcPSFO4VShFqESGe_5iHWGlBLwwwehFBfjrsjWv9&m=cYgtjV4k8YOLUz8vaTYnezwsPPucU6a90NC0CCZ-wus&s=BGxUoxRMjzsi2YVEFhFdMwGjoOowNBDJUcY669SdGPo&e=
  Paul Tattersfield:data coming from gTLD.link would need to be treated with caution I think
  George Kirikos 2:@Paul: yes, it's just one perspective, so should be weighted accordingly.
  Scott Austin:But isn't the danger of over reliance on anecdotal evidence that outliers can dictate the rules of the community.
  George Kirikos 2:(question 12 only mentioned DNForum/Namepros, so gTLD.link is just another data point)
  Cyntia King:Agree, J Scott.
  Greg Shatan:Anecdotes need to be tested to see if they are edge cases.
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):@Greg, as I understand Registries were not against providing additional info on their cases
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):just need to know which
  George Kirikos 2:More work, please! [just kidding]
  Lori Schulman:@Greg, how do we test anecdotes?
  Lori Schulman:they are subjective not quantitative
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):I think it was more like - looks like, does not look like
  Lori Schulman:J Scott thank you for leading 2 great calls.  We got a lot done in the last 2 weeks and it MUCH appreciated
  George Kirikos 2:Have a nice day, folks! Bye.
  Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):bye all
  Steve Levy:Speak with you all soon!
  Philip Corwin:BYe all
  Susan Payne:+1 Lori, fantastic progress
  J. Scott:ciao
  David McAuley:Thanks all, good bye
  Paul Tattersfield:thanks all bye
  Greg Shatan:Bye all
  Salvador Camacho:Bye!

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