[Ws2-hr] Notes, recordings and transcript for WS2 Human Rights Subgroup Meeting #3 | 30 August

[MSSI Secretariat]

Hello all,

The notes, recordings and transcripts for CCWG Accountability WS2 Human Resources Subgroup Meeting #3 -30 August 2016 will be available here:  https://community.icann.org/x/CxKsAw

A copy of the notes may be found below.

Thank you.

With kind regards,
Brenda Brewer
MSSI Projects & Operations Assistant
ICANN - Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers

Notes

1. Administrivia

Roll call, absentees, SoIs, etc

*        Dan Appleman phone only

*        Nigel Roberts - excuses.

2. Discussion on: the Summary on what was agreed and discussed on human rights during WS1 https://docs.google.com/document/d/1rwpw9aSAqboRO2_rNkjMVJPOmYwmdr5B1_M_aNMoZb4/edit?usp=sharing
*        Tatiana Tropina: no progress this week. Will simply add the text from the WS1 Final report.
*        Niels ten Oever: Hope to complete this document next week.

3. Discussion on: Concerns on possible impacts of Human Rights bylaw and FoI https://docs.google.com/document/d/1KcKGRJjuhKEzCh2AZ8PPR_MofOQFBN8CMuJqTG_h9h4/edit?usp=sharing
*        Niels ten Oever: Given the sad news from Paul Twomey there has been no progress as expected. It would be great if we could
keep adding concerns to this doc.
*        Tatiana Tropina: I have been going through teh records on the calls and chats to put them into the concerns doc but I am
waiting for Paul because he was supposed to lead this one.  but once Paul is back I will be ready with info :)

4. Discussion on: FoI draft document

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1emqmzyB9_0vm6oKxhIWZ47L7lxcFKUBHVnkBYUOsA2Q/edit
*        Niels ten Oever: Should the Framework be a core value? We should ask this of ICANN legal as to what the implications
of being core value imply. does nayone have an issue with this - no.
*        Paul McGrady: Seems like we would want to ask the community that, rather than the lawyers.
*        Tatiana Tropina: So basically you want to ask ICANN legal about this as a starting point for our further discussion?
*        Kavous Arateh: views of lawyers should not be priveleged, everyone has input.
*        Anne Aikman-Scalese: have no issue with asking ICANN legal. Still unclear what a human rights policy vs policy development activities in
ICANN. Would such a human rights policy imply that ICANN would have to make a human rights assessment of the propose
registry before contracting to delegate a TLD?
*        Niels ten Oever: you should include these in the document.
*        Tatiana Tropina: ICANN legal added the term core value and we should ask them why they did so.
*        Niels ten Oever: any views on this?
*        Paul McGrady: Agree.  I'd like to know why they made that unilateral change, but I don't think we need them to define "core" for us.
*        Farzaneh Badii: Let us find out who suggested using Core Value.
*        Daniel Appelman: I disagree with separating policy from operations.  That would weaken any human rights commitment we
recommend as a policy matter.  Operations should be consistent with policy.
*        Niels Ten Oever: Will ask staff to pass on this question to ICANN legal - ACTION ITEM. Niels ten Oever: Question to ICANN legal: 'What
is the rationale for the addition of 'core values' to the ICANN bylaws, and what are its legal and non-legal implications in your opinion, especially for the human rights bylaw?
*        Niels Ten Oever: What is meant by International Human Rights? I have pasted several refernces in the document which could help with this.
*        Tatiana Tropina: Uncertain that these instruments which are applicable to states are not applicable to ICANN. They can help shape of things for ICANN.
*        Kavous Arasteh: We should go through these and see which parts could apply to ICANN.
*        Tatiana Tropina: I think Kavouss misunderstood me Of course we should go through them I was clear about this. I am more than up
for going through all the conventions.
*        Anne Aikman-Scalese: to what parts of ICANN should Human rights apply? It would certainly include awarding a TLD. We should
identify policies and procedures and activities in ICANN which would be subject to HR.
*        Paul McGrady: starting with the principles and then look at how they apply is my approach - but we should end up in the same place.
*        Markus Kummer: The Board was very worried about unintended consequences. the baseline for ICANN will probably remain the
Rugge principals and which ones apply and see where we can go from there.
*        Avri Doria: an explicit exhaustive list of operations?
*        Anne Aikman-Scalese: @AVri - no - just certain test examples - how do Human Rights principles apply to specific activities of ICANN - a practical
application of principles in certain examples of  ICANN's operations.
*        Tatiana Tropina: I think there has been some job done on this at the CCWP on human rights which might be interesting to look at, Niels, do
you have anything to share on this?
*        Matthew Shears: I would turn that around Ann and suggest that we need to look at ICANN's operations and determine very realistically and
cautiously what might apply or not.
*        Matthew Shears: this should not be about trying to see what fits - but rather what is appropriate - measured against other orgs and institutions perhaps
*        Farzaneh Badii: What we need to consider what is in ICANN's scope. Does this imply that there are going to be contractual provisions for
Human Rights in registry agreements? I think the ICANN responsability stops at the string level  (unclear what is meant by string level).
*        Kavous Arasteh: Seems chair is unfair in analysing comments by particpants.
*        Anne Aikman-Scalese: @Niels - I think the document you linked presupposes a negative impact on Human Rights in all cases.  For example, it states
that there is a "right to use all words and names in domain names".  There is actually no such right and the entire scheme of trademark
protection for the new gTLDs demonstrates the balancing of freedom of expression against the right of the artistic community to protect
its artistic creations.  This is Article 19 versus Article 27 UDHR balancing. ARticle 27 says: (2) Everyone has the right to the protection of
the moral and material interests resulting from any scientific, literary or artistic production of which he is the author.
*        Niels ten Oever: We will discuss this on the list. We should go on to the issue of Applicable Law. Do we want to relay this to the Jurisdiction sub-group.
*        Kavouss Arasteh: Leave to the Jurisdiction sub-group.,
*        Niels ten Oever: Will contact Jursidiction to advise we will wait on their results regarding this.
*        Anne Aikman-Scalese 2: ICANN Legal should be asked what Human Rights Law is applicable to ICANN operations.
*        Niels ten Oever: 2. 'What Human Rights Laws and/or Guidelines is or are applicable to which ICANN operations.'
*        Anne Aikman-Scalese 2: should this be tgwo separate questions. Which laws and then guidelines.
*        Daniel Appelman: Getting the views of legal counsel is ok; but our own work this week should be to think about all relevant ICANN
operations and activities and then discuss what human rights are implicated by them.  Via mailing list and comments in the document.

5. AOB


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