[Ws2-hr] Fwd: Input from SSAC to the WG on Human Rights

Tue Mar 14 19:41:24 UTC 2017

Hi Neils

It may be my application mix, but If you look at the two attached emails 
which you sent (which I attach) , the word document does not seem as 
extensive as the PDF.   I had read the word document.

Paul

On 3/14/17 12:15 PM, Niels ten Oever wrote:
> Hi Paul,
>
> That's surprising because the mail went to the list:
> https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/ws2-hr/2017-March/thread.html
>
> As you can see in the considerations document this point has been
> carefully and extensively addressed in the Considerations document, and
> we also discussed this extensively on the list and on calls.
>
> But all you concerns and suggestions vis a vis that document are of
> course more than appreciated here on the list and on the upcoming call.
>
> Best,
>
> Niels
>
> On 03/14/2017 04:42 PM, Paul Twomey wrote:
>> Hi Neils
>>
>> I did not receive your earlier email.
>>
>> But yes ICANN does have a range of agreements with ccTLDs. About 86 of
>> them.
>>
>> See: https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/cctlds/cctlds-en
>>
>> I have to say I am a bit shocked that you asked me this question.  I
>> think it is very important that this group needs to be expertly advised
>> on the day to day operations of ICANN's core functions, or else we run
>> the risk of putting forward a "theoretical" set of recommendations which
>> when examined by the members of the SOs and ACs and/or the board will be
>> rejected as putting existing operations at undue risk.
>>
>> Paul
>>
>>
>> On 3/14/17 4:06 AM, Aikman-Scalese, Anne wrote:
>>> Thank you Niels.  I am planning to attend this session.  I spoke with
>>> Patrik last night.  His explanation was a bit different in terms of
>>> the limited scope of ICANN's mission.  Tatiana also heard this
>>> explanation and may have comment.  However, Patrik emphasized that
>>> someone from SSAC would be present at the NCSG meeting on Human Rights
>>> mentioned to explain the SSAC letter and why it comes before an FOI
>>> being published by the CCWG-Accountability.
>>>
>>> Anne
>>>
>>> Anne E. Aikman-Scalese
>>> Of Counsel
>>> 520.629.4428 office
>>> 520.879.4725 fax
>>> AAikman at lrrc.com
>>> _______________________________
>>>
>>> Lewis Roca Rothgerber Christie LLP
>>> One South Church Avenue, Suite 700
>>> Tucson, Arizona 85701-1611
>>> lrrc.com
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: ws2-hr-bounces at icann.org [mailto:ws2-hr-bounces at icann.org] On
>>> Behalf Of Niels ten Oever
>>> Sent: Monday, March 13, 2017 8:12 AM
>>> To: Paul Twomey
>>> Cc: ws2-hr at icann.org
>>> Subject: Re: [Ws2-hr] Fwd: Input from SSAC to the WG on Human Rights
>>>
>>> Hi Paul,
>>>
>>> As far as I know ICANN does not have contracts with ccTLDs, right?
>>>
>>> In any case, I would like to invite everyone to a session of the CCWP
>>> HR * coming Wednesday March 15 at 17:00 (CEST) ** where both SSAC and
>>> an expert on Human Rights Impact Assessment from the Danish Institute
>>> for Human Rights will be present, so that might be an interesting
>>> venue to discuss.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>>
>>> Niels
>>>
>>> * Cross Community Working Party on ICANNs Corporate and Social
>>> Responsibility to Respect Human Right
>>> ** https://schedule.icann.org/event/9nmu/gnso-ncsg-icann-human-rights
>>>
>>> On Mon, Mar 13, 2017 at 10:43:14AM -0400, Paul Twomey wrote:
>>>> Yes Neil.   But think of how does ICANN do a Human Rights Impact
>>>> Assessment
>>>> on an agreement with a new ccTLD operator in a non-democratic (or even
>>>> democratic) country?    ICANN is not the UN Human Rights Council.
>>>> It would
>>>> be explosive.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 3/13/17 10:38 AM, Niels ten Oever wrote:
>>>>> Hi Paul,
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks for your response. Reply inline:
>>>>>
>>>>> On 03/13/2017 03:32 PM, Paul Twomey wrote:
>>>>>> Dear Niels
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I note the SSAC report.   I worry again that its recommendation
>>>>>> language
>>>>>> calling for a Human Rights Impact Assessment,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Microsoft Word -
>>>>>> SAC0XX_SSAC_Input_to_CCWG-Acc_WS2_Human_Rights_v1.1-CLEAN.docx
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "A Human Rights Impact Assessment4 is a process for systematically
>>>>>> identifying, predicting and responding to the potential human
>>>>>> rights impacts of business operations, policies, or agreements."
>>>>>>
>>>>>> has the possible consequence of inadvertantly trying to impose
>>>>>> human rights tests on agreements in the IANA function, especially
>>>>>> as they may
>>>>>> apply to agreements (written or explicit) with ccTLD operators.   As I
>>>>>> have said consistently in this process, this could be extremely
>>>>>> damaging
>>>>>> on the operations and global acceptance of the IANA function.
>>>>>> Hence my
>>>>>> concern about certain sections of the Ruggie Principles being
>>>>>> applied to ICANN - ICANN does not have the luxury of choosing
>>>>>> which parts of the world it may or may not serve.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> First and foremost, the first right of humans we need to protect
>>>>>> is having access to an Internet that is global and operates 7x24.
>>>>>>
>>>>> Isn't that exactly what the SSAC letter says in the first paragraph
>>>>> (as well as the Core Value, and the Framework of Interpretation) ?
>>>>>
>>>>> Best,
>>>>>
>>>>> Niels
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Best
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Paul
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 3/13/17 9:12 AM, Niels ten Oever wrote:
>>>>>>> Dear all,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Please find attached the letter we received from SSAC.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> All the best,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Niels
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>>>>>>> Subject: Input from SSAC to the WG on Human Rights
>>>>>>> Date: Mon, 13 Mar 2017 03:12:11 +0100
>>>>>>> From: Patrik Fältström <paf at netnod.se>
>>>>>>> To: Niels ten Oever <niels at article19.org>
>>>>>>> CC: SSAC <ssac at icann.org>, Human Rights
>>>>>>> <cc-humanrights at icann.org>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Niels,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As chair of the Security and Stability Advisory Committee, one
>>>>>>> of the chartering organizations of the CCWG on Accountability,
>>>>>>> we would like to submit the attached comments as fruit for thought
>>>>>>> for the discussions.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Best,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>       Patrik Fältström
>>>>>>>       Chair of the SSAC
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Ws2-hr mailing list
>>>>>>> Ws2-hr at icann.org
>>>>>>> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/ws2-hr
>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>> Dr Paul Twomey
>>>>>> Managing Director
>>>>>> Argo P at cific
>>>>>>
>>>>>> US Cell: +1 310 279 2366
>>>>>> Aust M: +61 416 238 501
>>>>>>
>>>>>> www.argopacific.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Ws2-hr mailing list
>>>>>> Ws2-hr at icann.org
>>>>>> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/ws2-hr
>>>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> Dr Paul Twomey
>>>> Managing Director
>>>> Argo P at cific
>>>>
>>>> US Cell: +1 310 279 2366
>>>> Aust M: +61 416 238 501
>>>>
>>>> www.argopacific.com
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Ws2-hr mailing list
>>>> Ws2-hr at icann.org
>>>> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/ws2-hr
>>> -- 
>>>
>>> Niels ten Oever
>>> Head of Digital
>>>
>>> Article 19
>>> www.article19.org
>>>
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-- 
Dr Paul Twomey
Managing Director
Argo P at cific

US Cell: +1 310 279 2366
Aust M: +61 416 238 501

www.argopacific.com

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