[CPWG] [registration-issues-wg] [GTLD-WG] Verisign Dissing Domainers?

Greg Shatan greg at isoc-ny.org
Sun Nov 4 04:37:56 UTC 2018 

Derek,

There was RegisterFly.... But I think that’s about it.

Greg
On Sat, Nov 3, 2018 at 5:26 PM Carlton Samuels <carlton.samuels at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Always a thinking fella, Evan. Grist for the mill.
>
> CAS
>
> On Fri, 2 Nov 2018, 11:20 pm Evan Leibovitch <evan at telly.org wrote:
>
>> On one hand, I am delighted to see such an acknowledgement of reality.
>> The use of the term "scalpers", while incendiary to some, is revealing in
>> its candor and maybe its intent.
>> However I agree that such an opinion is not made lightly, and is unlikely
>> for pure public-service reasons.
>>
>> So... why?
>>
>> Recently, a CBC investigation of Ticketmaster
>> <https://www.npr.org/2018/09/20/649666928/ticketmaster-has-its-own-secret-scalping-program-canadian-journalists-report>
>> revealed that the company encourages the hoarding and scalping of tickets
>> to popular events, and itself profits from the activity by getting revenue
>> from the scalped tickets well over and above the original selling prices.
>>
>> I see one of two possible related scenarios, both of which are plausible
>> though could be wildly incorrect:
>>
>>    1. Verisign is setting the stage to get a piece of the scalpers'
>>    action. It has watched as other TLDs roll out "premium" domains and wants
>>    to itself profit from domain sales that are inflated well past original
>>    value. It wants what Ticketmaster can do. While a scalper's revenue is a
>>    one-time sale per domain, premium domains may be perceived as a
>>    sustained-revenue path that allows Verisign to exploit a dominance in TLD
>>    space that really hasn't been challenged by the swarms of now registries.
>>
>>    2. Verisign may suspect that regulatory reaction (of the governmental
>>    kind) against Ticketmaster may bleed into TLD space. There are so many,
>>    many similarities between ticket scalping and domaining which is why its
>>    use of the term in the blog is so apt. This might be a move to forestall
>>    state intervention by indicating that Verisign will be proactive in
>>    reducing scalping on its own. The revenue hit may be offset by the good PR
>>    and reduced threat of governmental interference.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Evan
>>
>>
>> On Fri, 2 Nov 2018 at 21:46, Alan Greenberg <alan.greenberg at mcgill.ca>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> The RAA has always had a provision allowing ICANN to have a Consensus
>>> Policy prohibiting reistrars from warehousing or speculation. We have never
>>> taken action on this and I cannot see the GNSO ever doing so.
>>>
>>> The Verisign blog is interesting. Rare that a large company publicly
>>> disses its largest customers.
>>>
>>> Alan
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> At 02/11/2018 03:43 PM, Greg Shatan wrote:
>>>
>>> This post is actually taking aim primarily at REGISTRARS who buy huge
>>> numbers of .com domains at wholesale ($7.85 per domain) and then hold them,
>>> in order to try and sell them later for a premium price. That’s not
>>> really dissing domainers in the general sense, just these
>>> registrar-domainers.
>>>
>>> The writing is a bit sloppy on this point, and the blog pivots to ICA
>>> toward the end, but even there, the focus is on the registrar-domainers,
>>> not on the general domaining public. Look again at the post, and you will
>>> see references to “speculators†who buy at a “regulated price.â€
>>> That’s the Verisign price they are talking about. Regular registrants
>>> don’t have that opportunity — onlly registrars. The “Domainer Name
>>> Wire†article largely misses this point — partly because the post is vague
>>> and partly becausse of a tendency to “rush to judgment†in the domaining
>>> press.
>>>
>>> As Jonathan notes, ICA argues it’s protecting the little guy, when
>>> they are actually providing loads of protection for some very “big guyâ€
>>> registrar-domainers.
>>>
>>> While this is not “insider trading,†it is really a form of diversion
>>> based on insider access — the registrars abuse their privileged position to
>>> bbuy cheap and to buy before any “regular†registrant (even a domainer)
>>> can, and then they hold this portfolio and charge secondary-market prices
>>> for domains that are not really in the secondary market. Registrars’
>>> unique ability to buy domain names directly from the registries was never
>>> meant to produce this result. This is a bug, not a feature. The end user
>>> domainers should really be pissed off at the registrar-domainers, not at
>>> Verisign. (Of course, they are permanently pissed off at Verisign,
>>> especially with a price increase in their “commodity.†)
>>>
>>> Maybe registrars should be prohibited from buying for their own account
>>> for investment purposes. GoDaddy apparently has 2.5 billion reasons to
>>> oppose that idea.
>>>
>>> I don’t know if I would call them scalpers (though it’s a fair
>>> comparison). I see domainers more like the folks in Boston who get up in
>>> the morning, sit down in a lawn chair in a prime parking spot near the
>>> Fenway Park baseball stadium, and then sit there until game time
>>> approaches. Then they charge you $20 or more to get out of the way so you
>>> can park there. This is not entirely accurate either since this is a lot
>>> more work than a domainer would put in (at least for a single domain name.
>>>
>>> Greg
>>>
>>> On Fri, Nov 2, 2018 at 3:10 PM Jonathan Zuck <
>>> JZuck at innovatorsnetwork.org> wrote: We'll, it's not particularly easy
>>> to take them back. Blog raises some good points about where the money goes.
>>> The ICA rhetoric about small business is pretty silly.
>>> Jonathan Zuck Executive Director Innovators Network Foundation
>>> www.Innovatorsnetwork.org
>>> ------------------------------
>>> From: GTLD-WG < gtld-wg-bounces at atlarge-lists.icann.org> on behalf of
>>> Carlton Samuels < carlton.samuels at gmail.com> Sent: Friday, November 2,
>>> 2018 2:59:12 PM To: cpwg at icann.org;
>>> lac-discuss-en at atlarge-lists.icann.org Subject: [GTLD-WG] [CPWG]
>>> Verisign Dissing Domainers?   Um,.......hmmmm, a flag up the pole to
>>> see who salute you think?
>>> Assuming the posting it is sanctioned as official view, what is the end
>>> game here? Afterall, they are gifted ownership of every name, known and
>>> hitherto unknown, in the .com space! The domainers merely 'rent' them!
>>>
>>> Hmmm....we have a saying in my corner of empire, 'one hand alone can't
>>> clap'. Gotta follow the money.
>>>
>>>
>>> https://domainnamewire.com/2018/11/02/holy-sht-verisign-just-called-out-domain-scalpers-and-its-biggest-customers/
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ============================== Carlton A Samuels Mobile: 876-818-1799 Strategy,
>>> Process, Governance, Assessment & Turnaround =============================
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>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Evan Leibovitch, Toronto Canada
>> @evanleibovitch or @el56
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