[gnso-rpm-wg] Action Items, Slides and Notes from the Working Group call held earlier today

Wed Apr 12 15:12:53 UTC 2017

I agree with Georges that there is a linkage and that understanding the
seemingly inconsistent approaches is helpful to this group. Ultimately this
is a set of policies regardless of which WG is working on which piece.

On the other hand, I agree with Paul T. that this is not the place to
debate the finer points of Whois policy.

But where would one discuss the cross-over issues between policies? This is
certainly a right place for that.

Greg

On Wed, Apr 12, 2017 at 10:35 AM Paul Tattersfield <gpmgroup at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Adding issues outside the remit of this working group isn't helpful to the
> discussions of this working group.
>
> Joining the WHOIS working group would be the best wayforward. The people
> who want to keep the WHOIS open rather than make it more closed are
> desperate for help.
>
>
> http://www.circleid.com/posts/20170324_loudmouths_wanted_for_icann_whois_replacement_work/
>
>
> https://community.icann.org/display/gTLDRDS/Next-Generation+gTLD+Registration+Directory+Services+to+Replace+Whois
>
> On Wed, Apr 12, 2017 at 3:17 PM, Colin O'Brien <
> colin at partridgepartnerspc.com> wrote:
>
> +1 Georges
>
> Colin Thomas Jefferson O’Brien
>
> 321 North Clark Street, Suite 720
> Chicago, Illinois 60654
> 312-634-9503
> http://www.partridge.partners/
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gnso-rpm-wg-bounces at icann.org [mailto:gnso-rpm-wg-bounces at icann.org]
> On Behalf Of Nahitchevansky, Georges
> Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2017 7:09 AM
> To: Paul Keating
> Cc: gnso-rpm-wg at icann.org
> Subject: Re: [gnso-rpm-wg] Action Items, Slides and Notes from the Working
> Group call held earlier today
>
> Actually it touches on the point here. If you are going to make various
> arguments of alleged abuse in support of claimed transparency, then it
> would it is relevant to know whether you are supporting a lack of
> transparency in the whois side of things where abuse has been rampant.
> While the TMCH and Whois are different animals a number of the arguments
> being made here to support transparency have actually been mirrored in the
> other context and rejected by those seeking opacity.  And one major
> difference between ‎the two situations is that there is widespread evidence
> of abuse of the whois system whereas here in the TMCH context you do not
> have evidence of a widespread abuse of the TMCH by brand owners.
> Nevertheless, you and others persist on wanting to conduct a fishing
> expedition under the guise of so called "transparency" to try and find some
> alleged widespread harm that simply does not exist. To many folks on the
> other side of the aisle, it appears that this is not about transparency but
> more about some effort to gut existing protections and to obtain the
> release of confidential information of brand owners as to what they did or
> did not register.   Perhaps this may not be the intent, but we all know
> that once that information is out the gaming will really begin. ‎Again,
> perhaps there are tweeks that could be made to improve the current system,
> but there is no real basis for undertaking the broad review that is being
> sought and certainly not for undoing the entire existing system.
>
> ‎
>   Original Message
> From: Paul Keating
> Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2017 6:33 PM
> To: Nahitchevansky, Georges
> Cc: J. Scott Evans; gnso-rpm-wg at icann.org
> Subject: Re: Action Items,      Slides and Notes from the Working Group
> call held earlier today
>
> George,
>
> You can always quote me. I say what I have said. I only ask that you quote
> me accurately. The discussion here is the TMCH database. Please let's stay
> on topic.
>
> Happy to discuss Whois separately.
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> > On 12 Apr 2017, at 00:18, Nahitchevansky, Georges <
> ghn at kilpatricktownsend.com> wrote:
> >
> > Can I quote you in this on having an open and robust whois so we can
> > have across the board actual and real information on the parties
> > registering domain names and know who the bad actors are
> >
> > Georges Nahitchevansky
> > Kilpatrick Townsend & Stockton LLP
> > The Grace Building | 1114 Avenue of the Americas | New York, NY
> > 10036-7703 office 212 775 8720 | fax 212 775 8820
> > ghn at kilpatricktownsend.com | www.kilpatricktownsend.com
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: gnso-rpm-wg-bounces at icann.org
> > [mailto:gnso-rpm-wg-bounces at icann.org] On Behalf Of Paul Keating
> > Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2017 5:58 PM
> > To: J. Scott Evans
> > Cc: gnso-rpm-wg at icann.org
> > Subject: Re: [gnso-rpm-wg] Action Items, Slides and Notes from the
> > Working Group call held earlier today
> >
> > It says at most which domains it wants pre-emptiness and notice rights
> over.
> >
> > Hardly a confidential business secret. The information is a public
> record. And, After all the Information is instantly public the minute one
> pre-emptive sunrise registration is undertaken. The notice right is
> completely a non secret.
> >
> > And hardly sufficient to use to hide bad actors.
> >
> >
> >
> > Sent from my iPad
> >
> >> On 11 Apr 2017, at 23:18, J. Scott Evans via gnso-rpm-wg <
> gnso-rpm-wg at icann.org> wrote:
> >>
> >> There is a big difference from a database that contains all a company’s
> registered marks and one that contains a culling for only those it deems
> most valuable for protection in the DNS. The former is clearly open for the
> public, the later is not.
> >>
> >> J. Scott
> >>
> >>
> >> J. Scott Evans
> >> 408.536.5336 (tel)
> >> 345 Park Avenue, Mail Stop W11-544
> >> Director, Associate General Counsel
> >> 408.709.6162 (cell)
> >> San Jose, CA, 95110, USA
> >> Adobe. Make It an Experience.
> >> jsevans at adobe.com
> >> www.adobe.com
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On 4/11/17, 2:03 PM, "gnso-rpm-wg-bounces at icann.org on behalf of
> Jeremy Malcolm" <gnso-rpm-wg-bounces at icann.org on behalf of
> jmalcolm at eff.org> wrote:
> >>
> >> On 11/4/17 9:43 am, J. Scott Evans via gnso-rpm-wg wrote:
> >>> George:
> >>>
> >>> We have all followed this string. We understand that you and a few
> others believe there need to be wholesale changes to the Sunrise mechanism
> and the TMCH database (or at least the confidentiality of that data).
> >>>
> >>> 1. Do you have a suggestion for how to improve the Sunrise mechanism?
> >>> 2. I see very little support for violating the confidentiality
> provisions of the TMCH contract.
> >>
> >> FWIW I am also all for bringing the transparency of the TMCH database
> >> into line with those of national trademark registries so that its
> >> secrecy does not facilitate the kinds of abuses that George has
> >> uncovered. I have been an observer until now but I've just upgraded
> >> to member and plan to join the call tomorrow.
> >>
> >> --
> >> Jeremy Malcolm
> >> Senior Global Policy Analyst
> >> Electronic Frontier Foundation
> >> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Feff.
> >> org&data=02%7C01%7C%7C2528000b02f744c8d69a08d4811e3b81%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34
> >> 438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636275414221363260&sdata=FLU88IUnUq0DT
> >> ixWIhDAELHUtjhYZgxqHGr8ihACkQ8%3D&reserved=0
> >> jmalcolm at eff.org
> >>
> >> Tel: 415.436.9333 ext 161
> >>
> >> :: Defending Your Rights in the Digital World ::
> >>
> >> Public key:
> >> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.
> >> eff.org%2Ffiles%2F2016%2F11%2F27%2Fkey_jmalcolm.txt&data=02%7C01%7C%7
> >> C2528000b02f744c8d69a08d4811e3b81%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%
> >> 7C0%7C0%7C636275414221373268&sdata=GzYW9x04IhxeW3HTyWRedWTpbiQQOrfZff
> >> lAKXdh04M%3D&reserved=0 PGP fingerprint: 75D2 4C0D 35EA EA2F 8CA8
> >> 8F79 4911 EC4A EDDF 1122
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
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-- 

*Greg Shatan *C: 917-816-6428
S: gsshatan
Phone-to-Skype: 646-845-9428
gregshatanipc at gmail.com
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