[GNSO-RPM-WG] Proposal re Q8.

Wed Oct 2 13:03:41 UTC 2019

Perhaps the heavy lifting could be done elsewhere?

3.2.3 Any word mark notified to a national trademark office as protected by
a statute or treaty in effect at the time the mark is submitted to the
Clearinghouse for inclusion

On Wed, Oct 2, 2019 at 2:14 AM Tushnet, Rebecca <rtushnet at law.harvard.edu>
wrote:

> In GI-world, they distinguish between levels of GI-ness.  Some geographic
> terms merely identify the geographic "source" of a product, while others
> indicate more in the way of specific qualities.  So "source indicator" is
> in fact widely used to describe GIs (though many GIs are said to be
> source-plus-some-other-quality).  Some examples
>
> https://www.origin-gi.com/images/stories/PDFs/English/E-Library/geographical_indications.pdf
>
> https://www.uspto.gov/sites/default/files/web/offices/dcom/olia/globalip/pdf/gi_system.pdf
> Geographical Indication Protection in the United States United States
> Patent and Trademark Office - uspto.gov
> <https://www.uspto.gov/sites/default/files/web/offices/dcom/olia/globalip/pdf/gi_system.pdf>
> Geographical Indication Protection in the United States United States
> Patent and Trademark Office What Are “Geographical Indications”?
> “Geographical indications” (“GIs”) are defined at Article 22(1) of the
> World Trade
> www.uspto.gov
>
>
>
>
> Rebecca Tushnet
> Frank Stanton Professor of First Amendment Law, Harvard Law School
> 703 593 6759
> ------------------------------
> *From:* Michael Graham (ELCA) <migraham at expediagroup.com>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, October 1, 2019 8:31 PM
> *To:* Tushnet, Rebecca <rtushnet at law.harvard.edu>; claudio di gangi <
> ipcdigangi at gmail.com>; Paul Tattersfield <gpmgroup at gmail.com>
> *Cc:* gnso-rpm-wg <gnso-rpm-wg at icann.org>
> *Subject:* RE: [GNSO-RPM-WG] Proposal re Q8.
>
>
> Wondering out loud whether GIs are necessarily “source identifiers”.  My
> understanding is that they are identifiers of particular geographic
> locations, whereas trademarks are source identifiers.  GIs may be source
> identifiers, but to the extent they are then they would be considered
> trademarks.  So . . . am I missing something in the terminology?
>
>
>
> Michael R.
>
>
>
> [image: cid:image001.png at 01D49D39.23E390C0]
>
>
>
>
>
> *Michael R. Graham*
>
> Senior Counsel and Global Director,
>
> Intellectual Property, *Expedia Group*
>
> T +1 425 679 4330 | M +1 425 241 1459
>
> 333 108th Ave. NE | Bellevue | WA 98004
>
> Email: *migraham at expediagroup.com <migraham at expediagroup.com>*
>
>
>
>
>
> [image: cid:image002.png at 01D49D39.23E390C0]
>
>
>
> *From:* GNSO-RPM-WG <gnso-rpm-wg-bounces at icann.org> * On Behalf Of *Tushnet,
> Rebecca
> *Sent:* Tuesday, October 1, 2019 1:50 PM
> *To:* claudio di gangi <ipcdigangi at gmail.com>; Paul Tattersfield <
> gpmgroup at gmail.com>
> *Cc:* gnso-rpm-wg <gnso-rpm-wg at icann.org>
> *Subject:* Re: [GNSO-RPM-WG] Proposal re Q8.
>
>
>
> From my perspective, the key problem is that "source identifier"
> describes, among other things, GIs.  We can engage in special pleading
> against GIs and just carve them out, but I admit that leaves me a bit
> sour.  I also would note that the relevant statutes I've seen don't use the
> words "source identifier" either, so we are still shuffling off the
> interpretive weight to Deloitte.  (E.g., although the Red Cross also has TM
> registrations, the Red Cross US statute that has been mentioned in this
> discussion uses the word "use" to define one prohibited act, and "wears
> or displays ... for the fraudulent purpose of inducing the belief that he
> is a member of or an agent for the American National Red Cross" to define
> the other prohibited act.)
>
>
>
> For these reasons, I have come around to not wanting to add "source
> identifier" to the definition--I don't think it actually solves the problem
> and it might make things even less clear.  Other than that, I do think we
> have gotten a lot closer.
>
>
>
> 
>
>
>
>
>
> Rebecca Tushnet
>
> Frank Stanton Professor of First Amendment Law, Harvard Law School
> 703 593 6759
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* claudio di gangi <ipcdigangi at gmail.com>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, October 1, 2019 4:11 PM
> *To:* Paul Tattersfield <gpmgroup at gmail.com>
> *Cc:* Tushnet, Rebecca <rtushnet at law.harvard.edu>; gnso-rpm-wg <
> gnso-rpm-wg at icann.org>
> *Subject:* Re: [GNSO-RPM-WG] Proposal re Q8.
>
>
>
> Paul,
>
>
>
> I agree with you; and you have spotted one of the areas of divergence
> between my proposal and Rebecca's.
>
>
>
> My proposal includes alternative language on this provision - that I
> believe addresses your point, but I am interested in your perspective.
>
> Best regards,
> Claudio
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, Oct 1, 2019 at 4:00 PM Paul Tattersfield <gpmgroup at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> Rebecca, I believe in 3.2.3 you should not add the words "as trademarks"
> as the marks concerned are not trademarks. For example once such 6ter marks
> are communicated to the USPTO and are accepted it is not possible for any
> organization to register a trademark containing the mark and importantly
> that includes the originating entity itself. Instead an 89 serial is
> created so the mark turns up in an examining attorney’s search etc.
>
> Best regards, Paul
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, Oct 1, 2019 at 8:04 PM Tushnet, Rebecca <rtushnet at law.harvard.edu>
> wrote:
>
> This is the same text but with the subject line proper.
>
>
>
>
>
> Rebecca Tushnet
>
> Frank Stanton Professor of First Amendment Law, Harvard Law School
> 703 593 6759
>
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