[CPWG] PIR sale…

Fri Jan 10 11:45:34 UTC 2020

Greg,

I think it's a good idea to revisit your statement ...
"More specifically, ownership of .ORG by a non-profit has a nice symmetry
to it.  It's easy to like, people are used to it, and it may even stop bad
things from happening.  But ... there is no reason to presume that
ownership by a non-profit is truly in the best interests of .ORG, its users
or the general public.  If there's a reason to say that ownership by Ethos
Capital will serve those interests well, it will need to come from facts
and action (much of it from Ethos, PIR and even ISOC); we can't presume
that either."

I believe it's a mistake to dismiss the organized grassroots resistance to
the Ethos/iSOC transaction with the comment "It's easy to like, people are
used to it, and it may even stop bad things from happening".

There's a principle that's emerging from highly respected community members
including well respected people like Esther Dyson and Katherine Maher. The
principle is "End users benefit from a long-term commitment to the open and
noncommercial internet".

There's also historical precedence that this principle was achieved in
practice when ICANN gave the stewardship of PIR to iSOC in 2003.

End users have enjoyed a long history of benefitting from an open and
noncommercial internet ... linux.org, Free Software Foundation (www.fsf.org),
wikipedia.org ... and on ... and on. This is a fundamental aspect of the
Internet that benefits end users. It's important that this benefit to end
users is acknowledged ... and protected. It's not simply a warm fuzzy
feeling. Benefits to end users of an open and noncommercial internet are
real and often threatened by commercial interests.

The propose $1 Billion transaction between Ethos and iSOC breaks the
principle of ICANN's longterm commitment to a open and
noncommercial interest entrusted to iSOC in 2003. It's more than just
"nice symmetry"
as you state.

I think At-Large's reputation would benefit if we acknowledge the well
established benefits that end users receive from "a long term commitment
to the open and noncommercial internet" in any statement that comes out of
this discussion.

Cheers!
David

On Wed, Jan 8, 2020 at 5:31 PM Greg Shatan <greg at isoc-ny.org> wrote:

> I agree that our voice needs to be heard.  But what is that voice going to
> say?
>
> The Malthouse piece is a terrible blueprint for what that voice should be
> saying.  Frankly, it's misguided and even offensive.  If anything, we
> should be pushing back on it -- but by putting out different and better
> ideas, not by getting into a flame war.
>
> I don't support a hasty conclusion that the public interest aspect of .ORG
> is being abandoned (easily or not).  At best, there is cause for concern.
> But a rush to judgment is not the way to deal with those concerns.  We have
> the opportunity to frame the discussion, by asking solid, well-grounded
> questions, by proposing some principles/guideposts, and by providing advice
> on how to resolve these concerns -- which could mean a sale that allays our
> concerns and that goes through, or a sale that substantiates our concerns
> and doesn't go through.
>
> More specifically, ownership of .ORG by a non-profit has a nice symmetry
> to it.  It's easy to like, people are used to it, and it may even stop bad
> things from happening.  But ... there is no reason to presume that
> ownership by a non-profit is truly in the best interests of .ORG, its users
> or the general public.  If there's a reason to say that ownership by Ethos
> Capital will serve those interests well, it will need to come from facts
> and action (much of it from Ethos, PIR and even ISOC); we can't presume
> that either.
>
> We need to be the voice of the end-user, a voice of reason, and a voice
> for the public interest.  We need to sort the wheat from the chaff.  We may
> want to have our own meeting with ISOC, PIR and Ethos to get at the facts
> and dispel the myths.  As ALAC/At-Large, we have the platform to ask for
> that.
>
> If we join the pitchfork-and-torches crowd, we lose our unique voice and
> place in the ecosystem.  We become followers, not leaders.  We become
> enablers (and even spreaders) of FUD, rather than dispellers of FUD.
>
> So, let's find our voice.  But first we need to find our collective
> thoughts.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Greg
>
>
> Greg Shatan
> greg at isoc-ny.org
> President, ISOC-NY
> *"The Internet is for everyone"*
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 8, 2020 at 4:50 PM Marita Moll <mmoll at ca.inter.net> wrote:
>
>> I am afraid I am starting to feel this way as well. The end user voice
>> that we are here to provide is becoming a glaring absence. And we need to
>> do more than ask for a seat on the PIR board. We should be joining our
>> voice to others asking why and how the public interest aspect of this
>> corner of the ecosystem can be so easily abandoned.
>>
>> Marita
>> On 1/8/2020 4:33 AM, Vittorio Bertola via CPWG wrote:
>>
>> Il 2020-01-07 22:22 lists at christopherwilkinson.eu ha scritto:
>>
>> FYI
>>
>> Hilyard Has a Historic Chance to Activate ICANN At-Large
>> <http://www.circleid.com/posts/20200105_hilyard_has_a_historic_chance_to_activate_icann_at_large/>
>>
>>
>> The main reason why almost 20 years ago we fought to create the ALAC and
>> preserve some form of user representation in ICANN after the cancellation
>> of the original At Large election mechanism was exactly to guarantee a
>> voice for the global public interest of billions of Internet users, against
>> possible capture or failure of ICANN's industry self-regulation model. I
>> have rarely seen a case in which that global interest is so clear, so
>> uniformly shared across the community and so loudly voiced. IMHO, failing
>> to act in this case would easily become evidence in favour of those who
>> challenge ALAC's usefulness and ability to fulfill its mission.
>>
>> --
>> vb.                   Vittorio Bertola - vb [a] bertola.eu   <--------
>> -------->        now blogging & more at http://bertola.eu/   <--------
>>
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